Runes of Magic US / AU

Quoted from "zidlef;568173"

I'm closed minded?? loll , they give you the options for getting diamonds and that is the only one you have now, live with it. If you really need extra ingame gold, sell your diamonds, sell gear or crafting items you make. Stop crying about something that made sense for them to remove, increase their revenue. We all know gold sellers were using them to mess up the economy of the game and we have one of the worst one on Reni, all know him. It's funny, i love this game and all the options you have to make gold, and enjoy yourselves.

But do you craft anything? do you only buy your stuff from AH like potion and food? i make a good amount of gold with those and all my guildies get them for free. It's called help your friends and they will help you.

And i don't care if diamonds sellers go away, i buy my own, as a lot in our guild do. We make the best of it and have fun. We don't run TOSH yet, we will soon and learn it, we don't need to be endgamers within a month like a lot do. We run people threw instances as it was done with us when we started and not rushing it. I think the GM's and CM's made their position clear on this issue and should close these threads.

Check my moto in my signature, i do believe in that ;-)

Sigh.... I'm not crying about the removal of Zeevex at all... I completely understand the reasons behind the decision made and even support it. The issue was the later mentioned Runes of Magic Cards also being a bannable offence.

My server doesn't have the Diamond npc's enabled so that removes that option for everyone. Gold isnt my issue I have more than enough and my toon is as geared as it needs to be at this point in the game...

As for the increase in revenue maybe...... I'm not going to comment on something I dont know about there.

As for crafting yep sure do dont sell any of the pots I craft simply give them to fellow guildies... Helping people? I was guild leader of my guild and helped many people gear run instances etc till a recent will remain un-named game started and 90% of them left to go play it instead...

Runes of Magic Cards was one way I was able to help guildies get there own dias too... not everyone that plays can either buy there own and in some (all be it few) cases players simple dont have the options to buy diamond as we do.
1 player in my guild is in the Malaysia no paypal and no credit card I'm sure there are others like him.

I agree with wiffo... If dia sales are only going to be allowed through item shop gifting there will be crazy price fluctuations on diamonds its the plain truth of the matter...

Quoted from "mrmisterwaa;568180"

That attitude is what causes the Economy to destabilise. A major of the US players are spoilt with diamond sales. I remember when I first started playing people use to buy diamonds when it was on sale and when it wasn't on sale ... even with the prices slashed people still refuse to give in. I hope diamond sales get reduced to once per year.

Once per year.. that's a good way as any to kill the game. Game is dying even with how frequent they are now.

The point remains that even when dias are 100% or more, this game is still idiotically expensive! Anyone who would buy on regular price is an idiot, because you need tens of thousands of diamonds to get anywhere close to endgame.

Quoted from "Dionaea;568246"

Sorry if I may have over-read that, but what server do you play on? All US servers have the Diamond NPCs enabled same as all EU servers.

The AU server Did mention that in an earlier post. We don't have Zeevex but we do use and trade the Runes of Magic fastcards.

My understanding of banning Zeevex is that they can be spent on things outside of the game same as our uKash Voucher option so I agree and fully support the decision made regarding them.

But the Runes of Magic Pre paid Diamond cards are only redeemable in game so wondering why they aren't a possible solution to keep players at either end happy.

No I dont play the US servers lag is to much but rules for one server will have a flow on effect to others.

Quoted from "Dionaea;568251"

AHA!

That explains it . So I will inquire about this special card you mentioned with the AU CM. You might want to link our discussion to AU forums as well.

Already done.. Our forums are linked since the update but the question of these cards was already brought up and answered by Nytefall

Originally Posted by Lemonater

A question that no one hast askered yet. Can we still exchange ingame gold fer Runes of Magic game cards? Be this still permissible, Dio?

Quoted from "Nytefall;567739"

This is not permissible - in a very real sense, it is gold-buying.

Just like zeevex, you're crossing the in-game/reality barrier with your transaction.

The fine print on the back of the card states:
This Runes of Magic Game Card is issued by Frogster America, Inc./Frogster Pacific GmbH and may only be redeemed on www.runesofmagic.com.au (AUS/NZ) and www.runesofmagic.com (US)

So Froggy get their revenue and players get diamonds win/win

Is there any reason to hope that in the future the terms of service will be rewritten to reflect what they mean instead of being interpreted a certain way?

E.G: There was no change in TOS from before this change was made. If no one visits the forums, then no one would know of the change.

Quoted from "CharlieBananas;568256"

Is there any reason to hope that in the future the terms of service will be rewritten to reflect what they mean instead of being interpreted a certain way?

E.G: There was no change in TOS from before this change was made. If no one visits the forums, then no one would know of the change.

Even if there was a change in the TOS... who actually reads it? >.<

Quoted from "CharlieBananas;568256"

Is there any reason to hope that in the future the terms of service will be rewritten to reflect what they mean instead of being interpreted a certain way?

E.G: There was no change in TOS from before this change was made. If no one visits the forums, then no one would know of the change.

I was under impression that this was in ToS whole time, but was not enforced - so no reason to change it.


@BenTAxeL - I would not be surprised if they enable Dias NPC on AU servers as well. Those other games that are actual took large part of US server population. (Another one will be F2P before end of this year)

As for rest, zidlef has said it all.
BenTAxeL

Quoted from "RoMage;568302"

@BenTAxeL - I would not be surprised if they enable Dias NPC on AU servers as well. Those other games that are actual took large part of US server population. (Another one will be F2P before end of this year)

As for rest, zidlef has said it all.
BenTAxeL

Whats with the profile link?
As stated I agree with the Zeevex decision just not the bundling of the Runes of Magic Cards with them.
This game is insanely expensive and one of the few reasons I haven't left is the amount of money I have poured into it over the last year of playing.
What I have been trying to do is put forth a compromise that will help both froggys profits and retain their player base.
Lets be real here all the You should just buy your own dia's isnt helping anyone.

Prime example is one of my guild members that regularly asks if I can buy him a dia card... He's studing Medicine at Uni so really doesn't have much disposable income to spend on the game but enjoy's playing it. Now if the decision is that I will be banned for making this transaction then Froggy lose's the sale on diamonds that I would be purchasing and the game loses yet another player.

I love playing RoM but our player base is dying and without player on servers we will all lose.

Quoted from "BenTAxeL;568342"

Whats with the profile link?
As stated I agree with the Zeevex decision just not the bundling of the Runes of Magic Cards with them.
This game is insanely expensive and one of the few reasons I haven't left is the amount of money I have poured into it over the last year of playing.
What I have been trying to do is put forth a compromise that will help both froggys profits and retain their player base.
Lets be real here all the You should just buy your own dia's isnt helping anyone.

Prime example is one of my guild members that regularly asks if I can buy him a dia card... He's studing Medicine at Uni so really doesn't have much disposable income to spend on the game but enjoy's playing it. Now if the decision is that I will be banned for making this transaction then Froggy lose's the sale on diamonds that I would be purchasing and the game loses yet another player.

I love playing RoM but our player base is dying and without player on servers we will all lose.

I don't really have a dog in this hunt, since I've never traded Zeevex tokens for gold or other in-game items, and I very rarely (perhaps twice) gift Item Shop stuff in exchange for gear--never gold. I *have* gifted Item Shop things to friends and guildies, out of the goodness of my black, flabby heart.

Having said all of that...

I've read the Terms of Service--you know, that document that you have to agree to abide by every time you log into the game--and I understand what Dionaea and Nytefall have said about trading either Zeevex tokens/card codes, or Runes of Magic card codes for in-game items. Doing that *is* a violation of the ToS, for it is essentially a Real Money Transaction (RMT). You are either swapping something for which you've spent Real Money--Zeevex tokens/card codes or RoM card codes--for gold, gear, potions, materials, or whatever. Or, vice versa. Doing so is not allowed by the ToS. It is absolutely irrelevant that Zeevex tokens can be used in other games, as it is equally irrelevant that certain gift cards can be used to purchase Zeevex tokens *from Zeevex*, for use in games that Zeevex supports.

I've also been around here long enough to remember and know that gifting Item Shop stuff for gold or other in-game items is allowed by Frogster/Gameforge, but has never been encouraged. In fact, it has been *discouraged* and warned against by the CMs and GMs *specifically* because people can be ripped off, in either direction, by unscrupulous players. ("Unscrupulous players? Surely you're joking!" "I'm not joking, and stop calling me Shirley." ) Such gifting for gear or gold falls under the heading of "Caveat/Venditorus Emptor", and if you get stiffed for whatever it was you were trading, it's on *you*. Gameforge is under no obligation whatsoever to offer recompense, nor are they under any obligation to "punish" the person who stiffed you. Also, while many people have called for a so-called "COD" version of Item Shop gifting, it seems to me that this would be in direct contravention of Gameforge's stated "not recommended/discouraged" position.

I don't want to discourage you from commenting on the US forums, but since you don't actually *play* on the US servers, perhaps your discussing this issue, or at least the issue regarding the RoM game cards (since Zeevex cards apparently aren't available in Australia), would be more appropriate with the AU CMs and GMs. Keep in mind, though, that since the AU game is published by Gameforge, your CMs and GMs, and *players* are all bound by Gameforge's global policy decisions, just as we are here in the US, and European players are in the EU.

Quoted from "BenTAxeL;568342"

Whats with the profile link?

My mistake, c/p it and did not like it showed the link, so typed, but forgot to delete link before posting. No edit on this topic, so it shows link on bottom of the post. Sorry about that.

So Dias NPC is not be good enough for your friend who is in school?

Quoted from "Malignatus;568351"

Keep in mind, though, that since the AU game is published by Gameforge, your CMs and GMs, and *players* are all bound by Gameforge's global policy decisions, just as we are here in the US, and European players are in the EU.

Thats the point it is a global game.. and dispite what server we play on we are still part of teh same RoM community. So policy on one server should be the same on others. If you look at the AU forum its probably a good reflection of our server state, not much is posted or discussed anymore at all.

I will give our GM's 1 thing if a player is scammed on a dia trade they will do whatever it takes to resolve the issue even to the extent of perm banning accounts. Our economy is cheap in comparison as we have never had issue's with gold sellers etc.

There seems also to be some discretion as your CM has not actaully commented either way regarding the RoM Cards only to reiterate the Zeevex position. Constructive feedback was asked for and a constructive response was what I gave.

Bottom line is the RoM cards are prepaid ingame items. Froggy has already been paid for them if they are redeemed or not. There profits will be better if players are able to trade them that's a simple fact.

The other thing i wouldn't want to see is OS players farming the AU server to buy fastcards and then redeem on the US servers, it can and has been done in the past.

At the end of the day yes we can all buy or own diamonds essentially making RoM a p2p game posing as free to play.
We can also look at the competition where even including p2p some work out cheaper per month than the amount I spend in RoM

I personally feel that having some way of buying a bulk amount of dias for your own use with ingame gold will help keep and bring in players.

Quoted from "RoMage;568353"

My mistake, c/p it and did not like it showed the link, so typed, but forgot to delete link before posting. No edit on this topic, so it shows link on bottom of the post. Sorry about that.

So Dias NPC is not be good enough for your friend who is in school?

If it were available I'm sure it could be

Dia NPC? You mean those 450 dias a month? When to be endgame in this game you need tens of thousands of diamonds a year..

Quoted from "BenTAxeL;568369"

Thats the point it is a global game.. and dispite what server we play on we are still part of teh same RoM community. So policy on one server should be the same on others. If you look at the AU forum its probably a good reflection of our server state, not much is posted or discussed anymore at all.

Again, these are the US forums, not the AU forums. Even so, the ToS for the AU game will be substantially the same as the one for the US or EU games.

Quoted

Bottom line is the RoM cards are prepaid ingame items. Froggy has already been paid for them if they are redeemed or not. There profits will be better if players are able to trade them that's a simple fact.

No, the bottom line is that the RoM cards are purchased with real money *outside* of the game. Trading their codes for in-game items is RMT, which is forbidden by the Terms of Service. *That*, good sir, is the simple fact.

Quoted

At the end of the day yes we can all buy or own diamonds essentially making RoM a p2p game posing as free to play.
We can also look at the competition where even including p2p some work out cheaper per month than the amount I spend in RoM.

In your case, as well as every other person who has spent their own money to buy diamonds, it is your *choice* to do so. Nobody has ever put a gun to your head, or a knife to your ribs and *forced* you to buy diamonds. You've done so by your own free will because you wanted something from the Item Shop that you could not easily acquire in another fashion, or in a timely manner. And whether you want to agree or not, RoM is not "pay to play"--a subscription game--such as WoW or Rift is. There is no subscription fee at all, and you *can* play the game to your heart's content without spending a cent on it. You may never become as powerful in the game as players who *do* spend money to get Item Shop stuff, but you *can* play RoM essentially for free. Never forget that.

Quoted

I personally feel that having some way of buying a bulk amount of dias for your own use with ingame gold will help keep and bring in players.

If it were available I'm sure it could be

Ah, another call for returning diamonds to the Auction House. That's not going to happen, you know. The CMs and GMs have repeatedly said that it will not, and they've stated precisely why it won't happen.

Quoted from "Malignatus;568415"

No, the bottom line is that the RoM cards are purchased with real money *outside* of the game. Trading their codes for in-game items is RMT, which is forbidden by the Terms of Service. *That*, good sir, is the simple fact.

Yes, but it's sheer sophistry to claim that there's any substantive difference between selling a RoM card code and selling diamonds. They are, for all intents and purposes, the same thing.

Quoted from "Borella;568378"

Dia NPC? You mean those 450 dias a month? When to be endgame in this game you need tens of thousands of diamonds a year..

Why rush? Are you the one who told me you hate people running into end game, (power)leveling without really playing The Game?

450 dias a moth, just 20 DIAS shy from $20 regular price for 9M in game gold.

Quoted from "Malignatus;568415"

Ah, another call for returning diamonds to the Auction House. That's not going to happen, you know. The CMs and GMs have repeatedly said that it will not, and they've stated precisely why it won't happen.

Not completely true. AH Dias were removed as anti-gold-sellers measure, but there is a way to prevent this from happening and I believe it is valid to ask new GM for Dias to return to AH.

Current (not even supported) gifting is creating more problems then fixing them...

So, please GM, check your notes and ask folks above if Dias can return in AH. This will help trade.

I am sure that there is a way to level limit dias sale postings in AH.

yea there may be more to this story than meats the coin purse. especially considering the newest wave of "unauthorized ninja-account sharing: 'excuse me foool, we gonna borrow this toon for a bit and spam our golds sellin' sites'

gold spammers on EU side are restless again...<ick> zeevex thingy may be another combative measure against the communist c@#$% s#$%^ stealing our stuff, which im all for.

wtb runesofmagicalness cards...need TP runes. and TP

Quoted from "Vaeliorin;568419"

Yes, but it's sheer sophistry to claim that there's any substantive difference between selling a RoM card code and selling diamonds. They are, for all intents and purposes, the same thing.

It seems that Gameforge disagrees with you. Since Gameforge runs the game...

But let's take a look at your "sophistry" claim. In this example, *you* pay $25 for a RoM card but do not redeem it yourself. Instead, you negotiate with another player for X amount of gold in exchange for the code on the back of the card, and then make the transfer. The player gets the card code, which he/she can then redeem for $25 worth of diamonds, which have been deemed to be in-game items. *You* get X amount of gold. This is a Real Money Transaction. There is no real difference between this transaction and negotiating with the same player to deliver X amount of gold to your toon in exchange for $25 being given to him via a PayPal transfer. None. There is also no difference between it and negotiating with a gold-seller website to deliver X amount of gold to you via a dodgy item sale in the Auction House for the $25 you pay to them. All of them are Real Money Transactions done in different ways.

Quoted from "RoMage;568436"

Not completely true. AH Dias were removed as anti-gold-sellers measure, but there is a way to prevent this from happening and I believe it is valid to ask new GM for Dias to return to AH.

What makes you think that a GM, new or not, would have the power to reinstate the diamond trade via the Auction House? Further, what makes you think that a GM would even consider asking his boss(es) at Gameforge HQ to overturn the company's policy regarding the diamond trade in the Auction House?.[/QUOTE]

Quoted from "Malignatus;568518"

It seems that Gameforge disagrees with you. Since Gameforge runs the game...

But let's take a look at your "sophistry" claim. In this example, *you* pay $25 for a RoM card but do not redeem it yourself. Instead, you negotiate with another player for X amount of gold in exchange for the code on the back of the card, and then make the transfer. The player gets the card code, which he/she can then redeem for $25 worth of diamonds, which have been deemed to be in-game items. *You* get X amount of gold. This is a Real Money Transaction. There is no real difference between this transaction and negotiating with the same player to deliver X amount of gold to your toon in exchange for $25 being given to him via a PayPal transfer. None. There is also no difference between it and negotiating with a gold-seller website to deliver X amount of gold to you via a dodgy item sale in the Auction House for the $25 you pay to them. All of them are Real Money Transactions done in different ways.




What makes you think that a GM, new or not, would have the power to reinstate the diamond trade via the Auction House? Further, what makes you think that a GM would even consider asking his boss(es) at Gameforge HQ to overturn the company's policy regarding the diamond trade in the Auction House?.

[/QUOTE]

What makes you think they wont?