Runes of Magic US / AU

Quoted from "Auros;541901"

That's nice TJ, but doesn't address the point of the OP

I respectfully disagree

It absolutely addresses point #4 made by the original poster.

Currently, and as confirmed by most posts on page 2 of this thread, any instant cast ability can be used while the capping interaction is taking place. This is not limited to rogue hide. I simply list out a large variety of other skills that are 100% normally functional that can be used to get any hidden rogue off a tower. If a character is using his/her skills as they function currently, and other characters can use their skills as they function currently to counteract them... then it is no way/shape/form a "cheat"

But... this is nothing more than the tip of a much larger question that only Frogster or Runewaker can answer... (yeah I know, never going to happen)


Is it "by design" that instant cast abilities can be used while capping a tower?

Quoted from "refugee;541751"

Lol, everyone knows guilds that manage their points for easy kills, but I seriously think you are the only one who admits they're only good enough to enter 'sure win' sieges.

How do I take things out of context!!???? please help me I'm so confused!!!!111

You can take what I wrote anyway you want my good sir.

We had 7k+ points quite a few times, the degree of how good we are is irrelevant. Like I wrote in my previous post, I never typed "sure win", I wrote "longer than 10 minutes" we did it to save time. Most of us were rolling around with well over 130k hp, t11 weapons, and tier 8 gear. We didn't want to waste our time fighting guilds that were equally geared because it took time we didn't have to run instances, not because we couldn't lol.

I really don't care. I don't play ROM anymore, I was just commenting because Refugee thought it would be cute to take what I said out of context.

Quoted from "ShanksROM;541943"

We had 7k+ points quite a few times, the degree of how good we are is irrelevant. Like I wrote in my previous post, I never typed "sure win", I wrote "longer than 10 minutes" we did it to save time. Most of us were rolling around with well over 130k hp, t11 weapons, and tier 8 gear. We didn't want to waste our time fighting guilds that were equally geared because it took time we didn't have to run instances, not because we couldn't lol.

No, what that guild is is one of those that doesn't care anything about anyone but themselves. They don't care about 'fair', so they probably would cheat if they got a guild as good as them.

Most lower guilds... the ones your old guild stomp on, are playing with lower levels, lower gear, and are in it more for fun. And it is not fun in any way, shape, or form to have someone come in and farm you for honor points, ROFLstomp you because they are so much better than you, or take everything but the crystal and stand there laughing while you turtle in your castle hoping to at least get something out of it.

There should be rules about how many of each level of players a side can have in siege. Like no more than 5 from level 70-72, 5 from 65-70, etc. It would IMO, make for better sieges, and a better challenge.

Quoted from "Keyshana;541985"

There should be rules about how many of each level of players a side can have in siege. Like no more than 5 from level 70-72, 5 from 65-70, etc. It would IMO, make for better sieges, and a better challenge.

Lolwut? Agree with everything but this point.. um.. so what would the endgame guilds do? Where everyone is 72/72. Most of the guild would just havve to miss out on sw?

Quoted from "ShanksROM;541943"

How do I take things out of context!!???? please help me I'm so confused!!!!111

You can take what I wrote anyway you want my good sir.

We had 7k+ points quite a few times, the degree of how good we are is irrelevant. Like I wrote in my previous post, I never typed "sure win", I wrote "longer than 10 minutes" we did it to save time. Most of us were rolling around with well over 130k hp, t11 weapons, and tier 8 gear. We didn't want to waste our time fighting guilds that were equally geared because it took time we didn't have to run instances, not because we couldn't lol.

Consider it out of context if you wish, I don't mind. I'm certain I understood it exactly as you meant though.

Right here again:

Quoted from "ShanksROM;541411"

Ohai Guise
we had limited time nightly to run endgame instances and didn't want to waste an hour in siege for the badges. Badges being the only reason we would even siege. We had multiple alt guilds we signed up to let points drop and switched accordingly when the points became high enough that siege took longer than 10 minutes. The 1 hour block is a joke and doesn't stop anything.
o/

You stated that you only went for the badges, and managed your points to keep siege below 10 minutes.

The absolute only way I am able to interpret that is that you wanted a quick easy win, not a siege that you may actually get into a long protracted battle against an equally geared guild.

Unless you meant you were rotating out with higher ranked guilds, so you would get slaughtered fast and get your badges that way?
I really wouldn't know how to respond if that was the case though.

Quoted from "ShanksROM;541943"

How do I take things out of context!!???? please help me I'm so confused!!!!111

You can take what I wrote anyway you want my good sir.

We had 7k+ points quite a few times, the degree of how good we are is irrelevant. Like I wrote in my previous post, I never typed "sure win", I wrote "longer than 10 minutes" we did it to save time. Most of us were rolling around with well over 130k hp, t11 weapons, and tier 8 gear. We didn't want to waste our time fighting guilds that were equally geared because it took time we didn't have to run instances, not because we couldn't lol.

While I don't consider it actual cheating, its really just ruining the fun of the game. Players on not so populated servers who would like a fair fight (obviously) end up getting hit for 130k by a druid when they are fully geared just isn't fun. Not all guilds do it because I won't. No one pays on our server because a siege slot is coveted, but you do pay in a form later because if you win with mercs and if the mercs leave, you invariably end up going against someone you can't win against on a higher rank and then lose. The whole siege rank fixing and no-shows/mercing is an issue that should be addressed so people who end up losing to people like that didn't waste their time either.

You're right, the siege prep phase is kind of a joke, but I haven't come up with any ideas to prevent something like that from happening. Like I said, not a cheat, just a dirty and selfish move to not play on your own level.

Quoted from "Borella;541991"

Lolwut? Agree with everything but this point.. um.. so what would the endgame guilds do? Where everyone is 72/72. Most of the guild would just havve to miss out on sw?

No. do a different bracket for endgame guilds, so that they fight each other. Yes, it may get boring for them, but those that are bored by it don't really want siege anyway. They want a slaughter and a merit/honor point grab.

If you are that bored with siege and need to maniplulate the game at other people's expense, find a new game already? Siege is one of the only reasons some people play.

The point system as it currently is more or less works most of the time. That's about par for Frogster's course- changing it would probably mess it up worse somehow. Every single suggestion I have seen posted that would "help" with mercing, or point-dropping/shadow-guilding would be a cure worse than the disease.

Keyshana's idea would end up segregating people- and that's not beneficial in my view. One of the ways you learn to operate in siege war is by getting uneven matchups. The best way to learn new strategies is to get them used on you. Segregating people would mean that the "nubby" guilds would stay "nubby" forever- they'd never get exposed to heavy-hitters or large guilds with good coordination and new strats.

Every siege is a learning experience. I say this as a guild that gets "farmed" for badges by PPK at least once a week. Being "farmed" is not a fun experience in some ways- but there are compensations. We watch PPK, and hopefully we learn something. We can see how the cream of the crop is gearing and statting. We troll them- they troll us. In it's own way it *is* actually fun.

As far as the list of things the OP presented- none of them are cheats or exploits. They may be exploitative, but they are not exploits. How you choose to use those is up to each individual's personal sense of honor.

For example- I personally feel that putting flame towers on the guild castle roof is a dishonorable tactic, and we don't use it. I don't get upset when guilds we face do it though, because I know full well that doing so is not an exploit- it is a tactic- just not one that I personally like.

We do invis cap towers though. As far as I am concerned, that's not even close to an exploit, nor is it even a dirty tactic- as flyingltj pointed out, there are a multitude of in-game ways to counter that tactic. In my personal view, invis capping is a good strategy.

But the point is- exploitativeness is in the eye of the beholder. People who put flames on roofs see that as a legitimate strategy, and they are absolutely entitled to do so. Just because I don't like it doesn't make it an exploit.

Quoted from "Concerned2;541130"

Over the years I have heard it all..... Lets get a post going on what is or isnt a cheat.

1. Using tower guards to take down a gate, cheat or not?
2. Using Honor Guard to take a tower?
3. Placing flames, etc where they can not be hit, ie in walls
4. Being invisible when taking a tower
5. 8 80k rogues that take everything in 15 minutes with a 600 score (LOL)- guild hoppers

I have had all of the above used on me in siege, not to mention the obvious stuff, like flying over the walls....

Everything except #3 I would consider as strategics. Nowhere has it been said that guards have to be used for defensive purposes. Being invisible while taking a tower, that's just using a skill on a rogue's skill bar, not cheating. As for #5, ...you can't limit how many rogues that's on team nor can you limit the number of "good" players.
#3 sounds like an exploit. If the tower actually can't be hit (which I have not seen), then it'd be an exploit - still not hacks though. People just abusing the technique.

One option I would like to see though, and i am sorry to say this, but there needs to be a way to conceed. Yeah, you outgear us and are ROFLstomping us as we exit the castle, but why won't you take our crystal? Why are you wasting our time? You all know there are people out there that do this, I guess because they can keep their score lower by not taking the crystal or something....is a mystery to me. Sure, I can "exit battle", but then i get nothing. Believe me, we know when we are outclassed, just let us end it.

Quoted from "Auros;542320"

One option I would like to see though, and i am sorry to say this, but there needs to be a way to conceed. Yeah, you outgear us and are ROFLstomping us as we exit the castle, but why won't you take our crystal? Why are you wasting our time? You all know there are people out there that do this, I guess because they can keep their score lower by not taking the crystal or something....is a mystery to me. Sure, I can "exit battle", but then i get nothing. Believe me, we know when we are outclassed, just let us end it.

Many people simply stop rezzing up and go watch TV.
I'm stubborn though, even if they out gear me I have to at least make faces at them.

Quoted from "Auros;542320"

One option I would like to see though, and i am sorry to say this, but there needs to be a way to conceed. Yeah, you outgear us and are ROFLstomping us as we exit the castle, but why won't you take our crystal? Why are you wasting our time? You all know there are people out there that do this, I guess because they can keep their score lower by not taking the crystal or something....is a mystery to me. Sure, I can "exit battle", but then i get nothing. Believe me, we know when we are outclassed, just let us end it.

Capping the crystal doesn't improve or change a winning score at all. Siege points rewarded are the same for a 6/5 win as a 10/0 win.

Sometimes people are just lazy or disorganized or off their game. Almost no one farms a one-sided siege war for fun, at least not in my experience. Usually the most OP types want siege over as soon as possible- they want to start their instance run sooner.

The last time that situation happened to us, we were just hella off our game. We tried getting inside the castle- the opponents had very well-placed flames and electrical towers, and our poor herald borked the tornado over and over, and everyone who had gone to get a scroll crashed or bugged or whatever. It happens.

I don't think anyone really likes to play with a overpowered guild's feelings. I dunno, maybe there are mean people that do that- but sometimes, especially with the removal of bleeds on gates- it can be very hard to cap a crystal.

Still, a concede button would be a welcome addition to siege. I dunno if that would encourage shadowguilding even more though. Something worth thinking about anyway.

it is still possible to cap all towers, and beat down both gates in under 15 minutes with no bleeds, no herald and no scrolls. just brute force.

I'd say what's KIND of like a cheat but more of an exploit is a guild intentionally glitching your gates by putting defenses on where it is to be constructed.
Tonight we fought a guild like that, and they glitched both our B gates and inner gates. xD It was a great siege war though; tons of fun.

Quoted from "L3g3nd;542555"

I'd say what's KIND of like a cheat but more of an exploit is a guild intentionally glitching your gates by putting defenses on where it is to be constructed.
Tonight we fought a guild like that, and they glitched both our B gates and inner gates. xD It was a great siege war though; tons of fun.

I was under impressions that this happens unintentionally when you kill the toon that is almost finished rebuilding the gates.

Quoted from "gstnet;542608"

I was under impressions that this happens unintentionally when you kill the toon that is almost finished rebuilding the gates.

If the toon crashes, it can't be rebuilt, not sure about killing him though.

Quoted from "mnkmurphy885;542075"

Keyshana's idea would end up segregating people- and that's not beneficial in my view. One of the ways you learn to operate in siege war is by getting uneven matchups. The best way to learn new strategies is to get them used on you. Segregating people would mean that the "nubby" guilds would stay "nubby" forever- they'd never get exposed to heavy-hitters or large guilds with good coordination and new strats.

Every siege is a learning experience. I say this as a guild that gets "farmed" for badges by PPK at least once a week. Being "farmed" is not a fun experience in some ways- but there are compensations. We watch PPK, and hopefully we learn something. We can see how the cream of the crop is gearing and statting. We troll them- they troll us. In it's own way it *is* actually fun.

I have the perfect solution to the sandbagging guilds. Any guild that does siege with less than 5 players is barred from entering siege for 3 days. If you do it again within 7 days, you are barred for a week. If you do it more than twice a month, you are barred for a month.

And if you leave a guild, and go to another, you are only allowed to go back to that guild once a month. Once to allow for mistakes. After that, you are stuck until the next month, on changing back to a guild you have left.

Quoted from "Keyshana;542647"

I have the perfect solution to the sandbagging guilds. Any guild that does siege with less than 5 players is barred from entering siege for 3 days. If you do it again within 7 days, you are barred for a week. If you do it more than twice a month, you are barred for a month.

And if you leave a guild, and go to another, you are only allowed to go back to that guild once a month. Once to allow for mistakes. After that, you are stuck until the next month, on changing back to a guild you have left.

All of this sounds like a bad idea. I've been in many sieges with less than 5 people, and some of those are the most fun. Don't punish legit guilds that have low numbers (eg. many of the guilds around 1k pts or less). You also can't guarantee a certain number of players will be logged into siege on any given day that you sign up for

And saying you can't switch back to a guild for a month? seriously, that's a silly limitation, people shop around for guilds and switch every so often for reasons other than siege