Weapon Leveling

Master of the Storyteller

Location: Indigo - The small and feisty server

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Thursday, April 3rd 2014, 2:30pm

Going back to the warlock point. Elite changed physical damage to magical damage. However the skills still have all the characteristics of a physical skill. So yes they now to magic damage but it will miss 70% or more of the time on a geared rogue or knight for example. It will never miss against a mage. EVERY natural warlock skill is based off magic resistance, accuracy etc. Which is how I think the elites should be. When the elite changes them to instant casting "spells" they should become like all other instant casts.

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Darwec

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Thursday, April 3rd 2014, 3:05pm

Quoted from "Mrpushpop"

Going back to the warlock point. Elite changed physical damage to magical damage. However the skills still have all the characteristics of a physical skill. So yes they now to magic damage but it will miss 70% or more of the time on a geared rogue or knight for example. It will never miss against a mage. EVERY natural warlock skill is based off magic resistance, accuracy etc. Which is how I think the elites should be. When the elite changes them to instant casting "spells" they should become like all other instant casts.

I just dont understand why you would miss any more than a knight warrior or ward since they dont stack any dex either. Is it dodge, due to lack of dex/acc? or MIss due to weapon training?

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Mrpushpop

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Thursday, April 3rd 2014, 5:23pm

Honestly I have not tested every aspect but I believe it is because a warlock has no phy accuracy, Using these skills has the same chance of hitting as I believe walking up to a knight or warden and trying to hit them with a weapon. I have tested the skills against every class type because it bugged me when I first discovered. Rogues are almost a guaranteed miss followed by the other phy classes.

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KingSilverRiver

Beginner

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Saturday, April 5th 2014, 4:41pm

Quoted from "camagic"

to make it absolutely clear:
miss rate
weapon skill vs pdef skill+level difference
this is for both physical attacks, magical attacks, and yes, even heals can miss.

dodge/resist
acc vs dodge+level diference
m acc vs m resist+level difference

parry for reduced damage. not known what/if rolled vs.

crit
crit rate vs crit resistance+level difference

So, even if i have max leveled my bow, I will still need a fair amount of dex if I expect my [Shot] to hit high level rogues with high reliability? Because dex is the only stat that affects pacc (at least according to gamepedia)? As a m/s, I am reluctant to be wasting stat spots with dex, but maybe I should make a few pieces of gear just for pvp that are all dex/int & dex/matt? Shot will be nice with buffs from lvl 70 m/s elites

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Darwec

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Saturday, April 5th 2014, 9:19pm

Quoted from "KingSilverRiver"

Quoted from "camagic"

to make it absolutely clear:
miss rate
weapon skill vs pdef skill+level difference
this is for both physical attacks, magical attacks, and yes, even heals can miss.

dodge/resist
acc vs dodge+level diference
m acc vs m resist+level difference

parry for reduced damage. not known what/if rolled vs.

crit
crit rate vs crit resistance+level difference

So, even if i have max leveled my bow, I will still need a fair amount of dex if I expect my [Shot] to hit high level rogues with high reliability? Because dex is the only stat that affects pacc (at least according to gamepedia)? As a m/s, I am reluctant to be wasting stat spots with dex, but maybe I should make a few pieces of gear just for pvp that are all dex/int & dex/matt? Shot will be nice with buffs from lvl 70 m/s elites

pop an accuracy rune in for sw. dont stat dex.

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Cike

Rogue

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Saturday, April 5th 2014, 11:46pm

can't put acc. runes in bows.

however, if you have problems with dodge, either get a piece with physical accuracy(more bonus than dex) ghost stat(cape, accessories, dunno), or find a high lvl druid in your guild/party to give you savage blessing every time you need it.

according to yoman, if you want to miss less with a bow(not dodge mind you), you need to raise your mainhand weapon skill. that would be staff(or wand i guess...) if you are m/s(i hope). since it is not required for mage to have a very high weapon skill at all, and the fact that you rarely hit stuff with it anyways, i would assume most mage's weapon skills are kinda low(unless you trained it for w/m).

my r/p can outdps r/m. your name is stupid.

mages should stack dex. word.

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achilleas1

Intermediate

Posts: 358

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Sunday, April 6th 2014, 3:07am

Quoted from "KingSilverRiver"

So, even if i have max leveled my bow, I will still need a fair amount of dex if I expect my [Shot] to hit high level rogues with high reliability? Because dex is the only stat that affects pacc (at least according to gamepedia)? As a m/s, I am reluctant to be wasting stat spots with dex, but maybe I should make a few pieces of gear just for pvp that are all dex/int & dex/matt? Shot will be nice with buffs from lvl 70 m/s elites

the bow/bow weapon skills are completely useless and bugged for many years

if u want to avoid "misses" in combat u need to train ur mainhand, that is ur (unfortunately, slow) staff

now, if u have a well-trained mainhand weapon skill, the next in line problem u meet is the "dodge" issue in order to pass the physical Shot-hit. In order to determine if a skill is dodged the game compares the "physical accuracy of the attacker" to the "dodge rate of the defender".

as already suggested, do not stat any dex at all. not a single one. put an accuracy rune in ur mainhand staff. then use one or two (max) pieces of gear with high ghost physical accuracy if possible so to gain the best possible.

if u still have problems with ur shots getting dodges, just accept the m/s-fate i d say, unfortunately. dont forget that u can always deal with the dodgie classes with TS or fireball or in general ur pure-magic skills. usually these leathers r 1-2 hitted

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camagic

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Wednesday, April 9th 2014, 12:07am

I tested out the main hand for ranged miss rate by running thru gobs. On my scout, I used no main hand for the worms, dagger for the goblins, and sword for the mobs in the final room. This gave about 60-80 total ranged skills for each main hand. I found that with an unarmed skill of 40/116, I only got 3 misses total on all the 60 worms. On the dagger skill of 99/162, I got 4 misses on the 80 goblins. And for a sword skill of 60/162, I got 10 misses on the last room. I used the same xbow the whole time, which has a skill of 146/208.

So it seems that main hand weapon skill could have some affect on ranged miss rate, but is not the sole factor.

95wd/95s/65d
server artemis
Please do not "class balanace" the tactics I use.

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achilleas1

Intermediate

Posts: 358

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Wednesday, April 9th 2014, 1:52pm

every scout has its xbow skill maxed or almost maxed due to the fact that doesnt have to stay afk at eggs or tundra etc to train them. xbow/bow just get trained even with utilization of normal skills (shot, va, autoshot, etc)

the best way to verify this "mainhand-based-miss" is to have a "main hand weapon of choice". this is a sword or a dagger, but would be nice to have only one maxed, the other at low lvl. or have a warrior subclass and pick an axe for main. then just go kill about 200 mobs of same lvl with each weapon and enjoy the 1% miss (on trained mainhand) and the over 30% miss-festival on the axe/untrained.

even if the xbow/bow skill is taken into consideration for the overall miss-calculation, apart from the mainhand, it has never been an issue since its always high enough if u r just active in game. not even need to afk. their main issue is the CAP of their mainhand weapons which is somehow low for the toon lvl.

so u end to see a rogue with maxed daggers miss on 1/1000000 and a scout with maxed xbow AND maxed mainhand (dagger or sword) miss on 1/100

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KingSilverRiver

Beginner

Posts: 25

30

Thursday, May 1st 2014, 6:58pm

First, thanks to all who have been posting in this thread. You have been very helpful. I have been investigating some more, and I have come to the conclusion that:

1. Accuracy Rune (e.g. rune that supposedly gives physical and magical accuracy) in mainhand weapon DOES NOT increase Ranged accuracy value. It only increases Magic accuracy. Oddly, it DOES NOT increase melee accuracy value either...maybe the rune is broken?

2. I have not found an equivalent rune that can be placed in a ranged weapon, as the above accuracy rune cannot be embedded.

3. Dex stat DOES increase Ranged Accuracy

4. Haven't found any other type of stat or rune that help with ranged accuracy.

5. Will keep leveling bow and mainhand weapon to help with miss rate, although it is hard to definitively argue that it is helping because I am also leveling my character classes at the same time. I haven't isolated bow/mainhand leveling to determine its usefulness, in other words.

Thanks,

King

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Cike

Rogue

Posts: 4,171

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Thursday, May 1st 2014, 8:36pm

get main hand weapon level as high as you can to minimize misses.

maybe it's just me, but I NEVER have accuracy issues. only issues with miss, which I solved with a couple nights weapon leveling. it may be because I am a dex build s/d that runs with 13k+ accuracy(kinda low, but still), and 26% physical accuracy change unbuffed.

if you are really having trouble, replace a couple stam/PA with dex/stam. ur PA will drop a bit, but it shud solve accuracy issues. also, as long as accuracy runes can't be put in ranged weapons, don't even bother putting in main hand. a curse would help more than the acc. rune.

my r/p can outdps r/m. your name is stupid.

mages should stack dex. word.

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CammoXD

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Posts: 746

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Friday, May 2nd 2014, 3:08am

Honestly wep lvling is all you need. I was playing somebody's ch/r on a different server (targ farmin op xD) and I just kept missing...it was bs, couldn't interrupt the skills due to it and hence would get 1 shot. Then I noticed his 2-h hammer (didn't have a 1-h) skill was at only 50 out of 240 or w/e it was....so I spent 2 days lvling it at merdin to about 170or so...after doing that it almost never missed again.
That's on a class that has no dex, my rogue on that server is 6 str/pa per piece, sits on about 35k str buffed. Dagger skill is 202/240 or w/e it is and that also never misses, while there is some dex on the actual pieces you can get my point, lol.

Just does not seem worth it to me to go and stat something simply for accuracy. And accuracy runes are only necessary in siege if you are having problems with rogues.

Cammo (82 M/82 W/82 R) 116,147 unbuffed Matk

(95k pa - r/m)
Livia (82 P/77 K/75 S) wisdom O.o wtf is that...
~~ retired - Thanks to gameforge for that. ~~

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Cike

Rogue

Posts: 4,171

Occupation: Being Human

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Friday, May 2nd 2014, 4:15am

just to be clear, dodge issues =/= miss issues.

miss is solved via weapon leveling

dodge is solved through using pacc ghost stats or using more dex(if scout or rogue).

that being said, like cammo pointed out, dodge should not be a problem, even for PA stacking rogues/scouts, and an acc rune should fix it for other melee classes if there is in fact a problem.

having a high lvl mainhand weapon skill is a must though.

my r/p can outdps r/m. your name is stupid.

mages should stack dex. word.

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Auros

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Friday, May 2nd 2014, 4:21pm

Is there a weapon skill leveling location after Merhidn Tundra? Must be, that spot is empty now where it used to be full of afk toons, nobodies talking though...

Govinda P/W/K/M 100x4 :pump:

Wl/R/M/Ch 100x4 :borg:

Wd/W/S 100/100/100
W/M 100/100 Glass Cannon: oh gawd, not again :pinch:

... and numerous others Semi-retired :pillepalle:

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camagic

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Friday, May 2nd 2014, 10:37pm

There is a place at the first plant you come to. I forget the name of it. There are some pillar crystal things that can be beat on, near where you talk to sismond during the main questline. It is almost like they were put there for a reason. From what I hear, if you are caught, you will earn a vacation though. There is also the pupas in ravenfell for lower level characters and the frog eggs in tundra for mid range characters.

95wd/95s/65d
server artemis
Please do not "class balanace" the tactics I use.

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achilleas1

Intermediate

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Saturday, May 3rd 2014, 12:55pm

i ve heard all ppl lvling it in sarlo map, though idk where. i m done with lvling so havent bothered to ask, but its definitely a place at sarlo

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KingSilverRiver

Beginner

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Saturday, May 3rd 2014, 3:00pm

Quoted from "camagic"

There is a place at the first plant you come to. I forget the name of it. There are some pillar crystal things that can be beat on, near where you talk to sismond during the main questline. It is almost like they were put there for a reason. From what I hear, if you are caught, you will earn a vacation though. There is also the pupas in ravenfell for lower level characters and the frog eggs in tundra for mid range characters.

Actually, camagic I found a post by SaitoHajime (a GA) from october last year that says AFK weapon leveling is no longer on the forbidden list. Found it under a thread called the NEW AFK rules. Did they change the rule since then?

the NEW AFK rules!!!!!

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Lemonater

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Saturday, May 3rd 2014, 3:27pm

Naw, Cammo tis misinformed. The only timer one done should be earnin a vacation tis iffn the person be farmin xp/tp whilest afk. weapon lvlin tis permissible.

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Purre

Intermediate

Posts: 180

39

Saturday, May 3rd 2014, 4:17pm

Unless something as changed, the sarlo spot can only be used afk by bow or xbow. There is one machine that likes to path near it; it will agro anyone beating on it unless they are on the hill out of range. It can still be used to raise melee skills, as long as you don't go afk.

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CammoXD

Professional

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Sunday, May 4th 2014, 2:30am

Quoted from "Lemonater"

Naw, Cammo tis misinformed. The only timer one done should be earnin a vacation tis iffn the person be farmin xp/tp whilest afk. weapon lvlin tis permissible.

I'm misinformed? O.o About what? D:

You can lvl weps against the Zuridion Lumbers just after entering Sarlo. The only issue is that even at lvl 90 I cannot find a spot where you do not get aggro unless you are at range. Still looking for this 'pillar crystal thing' ^.^
~~
AHA!! Found a new spot to lvl wep skill!! Pain to get to, as it was during the quest chain too, but it's at the tower of balance. Those 6 "Suspicious Device's" that you need to destroy in the quest regen the same as the tower. They only have 14k HP so easy to kill unless you have low lvl wep(s).

Guess I'll start looking in Wailing Fjord too, the higher the lvl the better.

Cammo (82 M/82 W/82 R) 116,147 unbuffed Matk

(95k pa - r/m)
Livia (82 P/77 K/75 S) wisdom O.o wtf is that...
~~ retired - Thanks to gameforge for that. ~~

This post has been edited 3 times, last edit by "CammoXD" (May 4th 2014, 3:04am)

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