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camagic

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Posts: 849

Location: noobville

Occupation: expert noob

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21

Monday, December 19th 2011, 10:01am

if this happened...

I voted no quite simply because those that operate outside normal game parameters will get a significant boost and those that are not pay(alot)-to-win will get the short end of the stick if the gates and siege engines are changed to "immune" to player attacks.

True that the gates, siege engines, and guards(which are just piles of merits now) need to be buffed up. The towers can also use some buffing.

I use the pbinfo addon which reports that the guards, towers, outer gates, buildings, and honor crystal are all level 55 elites/boss.I have not checked the siege engines, but they are probably the same. The inner gate reports level 60. The treacherys and stuff from the tower banner shop are level 50s. That is useless against a player that is 10 levels or higher.

I sent a ticket awhile ago asking about up grading the guards and attack towers. The GM said they could be buffed up via the drill field, but I have never seen an option for that at any drill field of the few guilds I have been to. I am not sure about the forge upgrades affecting them, but doubtful that they do.

I recommend that the guards, gates, towers, honor crystals, buildings, and siege equipment get their base level adjusted to 200. That way only the siege engines and towers will work against the guards, gates, and buildings.

Of course this will never happen as the siege qq-ers will qq. I have build a couple of characters that use skills and tactics to beat the pay-to-win opness, and sure enough, a "class balance" comes out and the size of their opness is no longer threatened.
95wd/95s/65d
server artemis
Please do not "class balanace" the tactics I use.

trav42073

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Posts: 806

Location: Arizona

Occupation: welder/fabricator/antagonist

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22

Monday, December 19th 2011, 12:45pm

Quoted from "Silenteye7;494968"

Then why doesn't it say something like, "I do not agree with this suggestion."? The way you worded makes it sound like by selecting the "no" option, you don't want the system to change period.

Personally I think you just need to add the option, "I think your suggestion is stupid as hell and if I ever catch you out on my PvP server, I'm gonna camp you till you rage quit."


Love this.


and mmocowboy, anyone who does a search of your posts, threads, will get a quick understanding of what you are. so how goes that hoto run? make it yet ? lol
95r/62m/63s/ Soultwist.
Ryaderr wrd/s/w erobos

TheMann64

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Posts: 340

Occupation: I do accounting, when I'm not cruising the forums

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23

Tuesday, December 20th 2011, 2:20pm

I think reducing the damage players do to gates was a step in the right direction.

Next step is to put the same limitation on the damage bleeds do to gates, or just make gates immune to bleeds.

Step 3 is to give siege weapons the same damage reduction that gates have.

Let's have siege weapons in siege again!
Govinda
Guild: Theblacknights
Babesmann - Dwarfmann

24

Tuesday, December 20th 2011, 5:25pm

make the guards at the towers wardens

siege will be hard then O.O!

25

Tuesday, December 20th 2011, 7:43pm

I vote no because as it stands it will be almost impossible to ever get a gate down with the siege engines. Regardless of their health or defenses, which is EXTREMELY lacking for the siege engines, they are WAY to buggy. They get stuck, players get stuck in them, they fly up into the sky, or fall through the ground. If you make it across to the enemy gate they get 1 shot or close to it by end-gamers. Making the gates, buildings, ect. immune to player damage will NEVER be a viable option until the siege engines themselves are fixed, first (as in not in the same patch, please).

You could argue that everything needs to be updated to meet CH 4 standards for elites. That would make things more challenging and still make it possible for low level guilds, assuming they fix the siege engine stability. Lvl 200?! That imho is a bit extreme, though...

26

Tuesday, December 20th 2011, 9:02pm

I think we should be able to buy ropes so once a gate is down and they rebuild it someone inside the castle can throw a rope over and I dont have to kill the gate again.:(

27

Tuesday, December 20th 2011, 9:53pm

Quoted from "trav42073;495006"

Love this.


and mmocowboy, anyone who does a search of your posts, threads, will get a quick understanding of what you are. so how goes that hoto run? make it yet ? lol


5 days until christmas, when this poll closes. Can't help but feel the love.

Quoted from "SwordofOmens;495408"

I vote no because as it stands it will be almost impossible to ever get a gate down with the siege engines. Regardless of their health or defenses, which is EXTREMELY lacking for the siege engines, they are WAY to buggy. They get stuck, players get stuck in them, they fly up into the sky, or fall through the ground. If you make it across to the enemy gate they get 1 shot or close to it by end-gamers. Making the gates, buildings, ect. immune to player damage will NEVER be a viable option until the siege engines themselves are fixed, first (as in not in the same patch, please).

You could argue that everything needs to be updated to meet CH 4 standards for elites. That would make things more challenging and still make it possible for low level guilds, assuming they fix the siege engine stability. Lvl 200?! That imho is a bit extreme, though...



Please reread the suggestion, not that it matters you already voted...

The date must be wrong. I set this poll for 7 days and it's been more than 3... wierd.
LOL...

Quoted from "turboreaper666;443339"

Here you go little angry troll....



My new favorite GM

Quoted from "Asteria;438081"

Really...

Hey look over there!

/closed.


Who says "you don't matter" better? :p

Quoted from "Kalvan;480948"

I'm always sorry when a player leaves our game, but making a forum announcement about it is...pointless.
/closed

28

Wednesday, December 21st 2011, 11:10am

Quoted from "rthomas88;495440"

I think we should be able to buy ropes so once a gate is down and they rebuild it someone inside the castle can throw a rope over and I dont have to kill the gate again.:(


i like it!

plus.. not voting on poll.. 'cos i only almost agree.

gates should be immune to all classes carrying daggers, pokers (those sad sad swords) and arrows (seriously? who you kidding Rambo?!)

on the other hand u hack at it with a blunt weapon or a barbaric warrior with a heavy heavy AXE should be able to hack it down.

of course.. Mages should be allowed to do whatever the heck they wish! why? 'cos we MAGIC bwahahaha!

umm.. not to mention, fire+wood+Hog mount=BBQ!

;-)

still.. i think it's hilarious we're all debating on the realism of siege scenarios! i'd be lmao if it wasn't for this stupid balloon monster that won't leave me alone.

29

Wednesday, December 21st 2011, 3:21pm

Quoted from "MMOCowboy;495462"

Please reread the suggestion, not that it matters you already voted...


Reread the suggestion why? Ok let me make 1 more point so you can tell I did read it and still say no.

Players SHOULD be able to damage siege engines. Like I said before they just need to be beefed up to level 70 elite status and/or have the same player damage reducing effects that gates have now.

30

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 10:35am

Quoted from "SwordofOmens;495594"

Reread the suggestion why? Ok let me make 1 more point so you can tell I did read it and still say no.

Players SHOULD be able to damage siege engines. Like I said before they just need to be beefed up to level 70 elite status and/or have the same player damage reducing effects that gates have now.


So what you're saying is that pay-to-win is the good part of siege and we should expand it to siege engines as well?

Sorry, that's not what this thread is about. Though it sounds like a facinating idea, I'd like to see you start another thread outlining the different ways less players can or will want to participate in siege.

Now I'll say it outright, I'm against the increase of stats for siege weapons. Aside from being immune to player damage, the ones meant to harm players should be changed to percent damage. Why do we have ballistas that don't even scratch people trying to cross the bridge. Why does it take 5 seconds to take down that ballista that doesn't even scratch the players.

It's stupid. Giving them lots of HP so only pay-to-win can kill them is stupid. If you're going to do more of this, just remove them from the game. Then remove gates from the game. After that, remove all those worthless things with less than 100k hp from the game. I think you call them players, nubs, scrubs, or something else that could only be entertaining to you. Don't worry, you'll have plenty of pay-to-win left over to satsify yourselves. Because that IS all you want, isn't it?
LOL...

Quoted from "turboreaper666;443339"

Here you go little angry troll....



My new favorite GM

Quoted from "Asteria;438081"

Really...

Hey look over there!

/closed.


Who says "you don't matter" better? :p

Quoted from "Kalvan;480948"

I'm always sorry when a player leaves our game, but making a forum announcement about it is...pointless.
/closed

KatalanOrk

Intermediate

Posts: 563

Location: Nijmegen, The Netherlands

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31

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 1:25pm

So, the idea is that everything should be completely balanced to players that have only quest gear, unmodified.

Siege, and PvP in general, should offer no incentive whatsoever to gear up, spend money or effort in the game.

Basically you want all the players that spend hours and hours making their gear, get no advantage whatsoever from doing so as you don't want to put in an equivalent effort. And you want to blame it all on favouring only players that pay heavily.

Is that it? It is not about making Siege more tactical, but it is meant to remove any benefit from improving your toon for Siege.

I don't really think that is going to help the game.

Perhaps you need to look at the game from a wider perspective, not just your own. The game must be balanced to the most advanced players, as otherwise their efforts, time and money are not rewarded and they will leave. And as they are the most dedicated players and set the benchmark for all other players to try to match, they are also the incentive that pushes people to play more, harder, better, or reach into their pockets and fill Frogster's.

I know a guy that made 16 accounts to run the Sacillian Steppes minigame when it was released for Fatal runes. I would rather castrate myself with a cheese-grater standing under a shower of aftershave rather than run a minigame 16 times a day, everyday, and so I will never be able to even slightly compete with those that do. Or spend more that 5 hours a day in game, or spend $$$'s every month. That doesn't mean that the game should be balanced to my level, it means that I will just always fall short without help from friends and the temptation to spend will always be there, as it should be.

This game isn't about you. It is about everyone, whether they are no-lifers or rich daddy's boys or whatever other insults you want to throw at dedicated people that put real effort, time and money into the game. I find the game very rewarding for a casual player as well, but you can't expect everything to be entirely pitched to the casual level. You have to accept that if other people try harder or spend more, they are going to be better and rightly so.

32

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 2:49pm

Quoted from "KatalanOrk;495852"

So, the idea is that everything should be completely balanced to players that have only quest gear, unmodified.

Siege, and PvP in general, should offer no incentive whatsoever to gear up, spend money or effort in the game.

Basically you want all the players that spend hours and hours making their gear, get no advantage whatsoever from doing so as you don't want to put in an equivalent effort. And you want to blame it all on favouring only players that pay heavily.

Is that it? It is not about making Siege more tactical, but it is meant to remove any benefit from improving your toon for Siege.

I don't really think that is going to help the game.

Perhaps you need to look at the game from a wider perspective, not just your own. The game must be balanced to the most advanced players, as otherwise their efforts, time and money are not rewarded and they will leave. And as they are the most dedicated players and set the benchmark for all other players to try to match, they are also the incentive that pushes people to play more, harder, better, or reach into their pockets and fill Frogster's.

I know a guy that made 16 accounts to run the Sacillian Steppes minigame when it was released for Fatal runes. I would rather castrate myself with a cheese-grater standing under a shower of aftershave rather than run a minigame 16 times a day, everyday, and so I will never be able to even slightly compete with those that do. Or spend more that 5 hours a day in game, or spend $$$'s every month. That doesn't mean that the game should be balanced to my level, it means that I will just always fall short without help from friends and the temptation to spend will always be there, as it should be.

This game isn't about you. It is about everyone, whether they are no-lifers or rich daddy's boys or whatever other insults you want to throw at dedicated people that put real effort, time and money into the game. I find the game very rewarding for a casual player as well, but you can't expect everything to be entirely pitched to the casual level. You have to accept that if other people try harder or spend more, they are going to be better and rightly so.


No, nobody said any of the things mentioned in your post.
LOL...

Quoted from "turboreaper666;443339"

Here you go little angry troll....



My new favorite GM

Quoted from "Asteria;438081"

Really...

Hey look over there!

/closed.


Who says "you don't matter" better? :p

Quoted from "Kalvan;480948"

I'm always sorry when a player leaves our game, but making a forum announcement about it is...pointless.
/closed

KatalanOrk

Intermediate

Posts: 563

Location: Nijmegen, The Netherlands

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33

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 3:10pm

Quoted from "MMOCowboy;495821"

... pay-to-win is the good part of siege and we should expand it to siege engines as well? Sorry, that's not what this thread is about.

...start another thread outlining the different ways less players can or will want to participate in siege...

...changed to percent damage...

It's stupid. ...so only pay-to-win can kill them is stupid.

...remove all those worthless things with less than 100k hp from the game. I think you call them players...

... pay-to-win left over to satsify yourselves. Because that IS all you want, isn't it?


According to you, only players that pay to win (omg isn't that awful, players paying for diamonds - really they should be banned for such an offence) should be geared. No one else can have any kind of gear.

You want % damage, engines that are wholly impervious to player damage, which are at least 2 ideas that mean you could be naked or endgame geared toon and it would make no difference.

34

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 3:50pm

Quoted from "KatalanOrk;495882"

According to you, only players that pay to win (omg isn't that awful, players paying for diamonds - really they should be banned for such an offence) should be geared. No one else can have any kind of gear.

You want % damage, engines that are wholly impervious to player damage, which are at least 2 ideas that mean you could be naked or endgame geared toon and it would make no difference.


Again, invalid point. Please stay on topic and stop trying to confuse players with your word twisting. This isn't a thread to bash good gear, it's to improve siege (for all players).
LOL...

Quoted from "turboreaper666;443339"

Here you go little angry troll....



My new favorite GM

Quoted from "Asteria;438081"

Really...

Hey look over there!

/closed.


Who says "you don't matter" better? :p

Quoted from "Kalvan;480948"

I'm always sorry when a player leaves our game, but making a forum announcement about it is...pointless.
/closed

35

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 3:54pm

Quoted from "MMOCowboy;495821"

So what you're saying is that pay-to-win is the good part of siege and we should expand it to siege engines as well?

Sorry, that's not what this thread is about. Though it sounds like a facinating idea, I'd like to see you start another thread outlining the different ways less players can or will want to participate in siege.

Now I'll say it outright, I'm against the increase of stats for siege weapons. Aside from being immune to player damage, the ones meant to harm players should be changed to percent damage. Why do we have ballistas that don't even scratch people trying to cross the bridge. Why does it take 5 seconds to take down that ballista that doesn't even scratch the players.

It's stupid. Giving them lots of HP so only pay-to-win can kill them is stupid. If you're going to do more of this, just remove them from the game. Then remove gates from the game. After that, remove all those worthless things with less than 100k hp from the game. I think you call them players, nubs, scrubs, or something else that could only be entertaining to you. Don't worry, you'll have plenty of pay-to-win left over to satsify yourselves. Because that IS all you want, isn't it?


Ummm... Hey, bro. Where did I say that exactly? I think you need to reread. I never said anything about pay-to-win and especially not about expanding that to siege engines.

Actually there are different types of siege engines and having them beefed up to 70 elites not only makes them harder for players to kill but also means the siege engines meant to kill players would be able to kill your "pay-2-win" players.

Your idea is the one that will have people not want to play imo. I for 1 will not play siege at all if that means a level 1 toon can jump naked into a ballista and pew pew me with % based damage while I cannot defend myself(since you say players should not be able to attack them back). I have worked hard to get my toon to end game without being pay-to-win and I'm not gonna go down like that.

I also never said just give them a bunch more HP. They need defenses or let them take reduced damage as I actually said.

% based damage I can agree with but beef up the defs and let me fight back.

See I can post a reasonable thought without attacking you. See I don't know you in game and I don't know if you are pay-to-win, free to play, or somewhere in between like me so I'm not gonna even pretend to assume I know what you want and make sarcastic comments about it. I will tell you what I like about this game. People can play it and get to end game with more than 1 option. You can spend your time or you can spend your money or you can do a little of both. Awesome.

Please learn how to have a reasonable adult conversation.

Thank you. That is all.

KatalanOrk

Intermediate

Posts: 563

Location: Nijmegen, The Netherlands

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36

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 3:57pm

Quoted from "Cowboy"

Please stay on topic and stop trying to confuse players with your word twisting.


Perhaps you have difficulty remembering but it was you that brought up the issue of pay-to-win because someone disagreed with your idea.

Perhaps if you could stay on topic rather than making ad hominem attacks against everyone that disagrees with you, the idea of Siege Engines role in Siege would be better discussed.

37

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 4:28pm

Quoted from "KatalanOrk;495903"

Perhaps you have difficulty remembering but it was you that brought up the issue of pay-to-win because someone disagreed with your idea.

Perhaps if you could stay on topic rather than making ad hominem attacks against everyone that disagrees with you, the idea of Siege Engines role in Siege would be better discussed.


The suggestion being responded to was another pay-to-win suggestion so it was valid in that instance. The person making the suggestion was spreading his words to confuse readers so I cleared up the confusion. Dragging it out so you can troll more is NOT ok. Pretending you didn't know this from the start so you can keep posting nonsense in this thread is NOT ok. But then, you couldn't come up with a valid point other than to just say "I disagree cause I can."

But hey, your post count is going up right. Troll more, seems to be profitable.
LOL...

Quoted from "turboreaper666;443339"

Here you go little angry troll....



My new favorite GM

Quoted from "Asteria;438081"

Really...

Hey look over there!

/closed.


Who says "you don't matter" better? :p

Quoted from "Kalvan;480948"

I'm always sorry when a player leaves our game, but making a forum announcement about it is...pointless.
/closed

38

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 4:31pm

Quoted from "MMOCowboy;495914"

The suggestion being responded to was another pay-to-win suggestion so it was valid in that instance.


Actually, you are the one that was confused. I never made a pay-to-win suggestion and since you were replying to my post, you are wrong.

39

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 4:36pm

Quoted from "SwordofOmens;495917"

Actually, you are the one that was confused. I never made a pay-to-win suggestion and since you were replying to my post, you are wrong.


Are you katlan's alt trolling account or what? Making siege engines have higher hit points so that they can only be taken down by the same people burning gates is a pay-to-win suggestion, hands down. There is no way that will improve siege.
LOL...

Quoted from "turboreaper666;443339"

Here you go little angry troll....



My new favorite GM

Quoted from "Asteria;438081"

Really...

Hey look over there!

/closed.


Who says "you don't matter" better? :p

Quoted from "Kalvan;480948"

I'm always sorry when a player leaves our game, but making a forum announcement about it is...pointless.
/closed

KatalanOrk

Intermediate

Posts: 563

Location: Nijmegen, The Netherlands

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40

Thursday, December 22nd 2011, 5:23pm

It is difficult to imagine that you are actually meaning what you say.

Again you are spreading the idea that only people that pay to be better than everyone else can compete should the HP of anything be increased. You are completely ignoring the fact there are many other ways of gearing up. You also appear to be incapable of understanding that Siege encouraging people to invest in diamonds is a good thing for the game, and for free to play players in particular. You appear to have your mind set on 'it is unfair that other people have better gear than me' and will not consider a single other factor.

And you are continuing with the ad hominem attacks, if a player thinks that Siege Engines should have their HP increased then they are just evil players wanting price all the real players (i.e., you) out of the game. If I point out your logical faults and inconsistencies, then I am a troll and I should be ignored. At no point do you discuss the points at hand, merely attack the poster personally and move on.

Your ideas are not the only ones that should be considered, and your intolerant and hostile attitude is something that is not welcome on any forum.

As was pointed out earlier, all one needs to do is look at your post history to get a good idea of the reasons behind this and other suggestions you have made.

I stand behind my posting history here, and on the EU and AUS forums where I have tried to help people, and learn and discuss the game that I find highly enjoyable.