Runes of Magic US / AU

Quoted from "ruisen2000;521613"

I don't understand the concept of charging people gold for the "work" of getting these items though.

Are instances supposed to be fun?
The idea that you should charge people hundreds of millions of gold for you to have fun is... baffling.

It is fun, and I didn't use the word 'work' in my post. Be fair people are spending a few mill and hours to get a drop, not saying that entitles them to rip other players off but to gain 4-8 mil per person is a rip off? What/where do you expect them to regain the few mil they spent from? farming Clops? KS? PS?

Quoted from "maomiai;521641"

It is fun, and I didn't use the word 'work' in my post. Be fair people are spending a few mill and hours to get a drop, not saying that entitles them to rip other players off but to gain 4-8 mil per person is a rip off? What/where do you expect them to regain the few mil they spent from? farming Clops? KS? PS?

Ahhh I see where the problem is...... the buyers are paying the whole party. The game is based on luck where only one player should be getting the item and selling it with the intent of only making profit for his/her self. So what is happening with pay the party is the price is inflated times the numbers of players in the party. So a 200m item is actually 16'666'666 per player in a 12 man party. The issue is other groups that go with the luck of the draw and one person gets all the profit the price is still going for the 12 person party.

This price holds until enough "parties" get the drops and start filling the market and causing the price to drop. this continues until the item is no longer worth selling as a party and becomes a One need per run and you can do whatever you want with it..

My question is when the party is gearing in new content who is paying for these runs? The wipe factor is higher and nothing is being sold. SO when they do start selling items are the prices inflated to repay the lost gold for all the runs to get geared? Is the group only keeping the OD stuff and selling the dregs or are the OD items being used until an OD drops? If so it looks as if buyers are paying the party to gear up. In my view if that same 200m could sell for 50-75m if it was only sold by one lucky party member and not spread between the whole party.

The other thing is guilds are holding items and making false shortages to keep the price up and keep other parties from reaching farming ability and killing the price of the items. It's about contol of the market and keeping items "rare" so the top players stay there and remain gold "wealthy". It's a way to make false demand and I know it because I've been involved in it in other games. If you hold the gear and let it out at a trickle you can keep the price at whatever you want because a lot of players are willing to pay everything they have to get the most powerful items and be elite.

This game compounds this elitest mentality with the one hour "Epeen Fest" called Siege. If Siege didn't happen every day players would be less inclined to be epic because once they ran the new content a few times. They would loose the desire to continue the rinse and repeat gear treadmill. Siege is a major driving force in RoM and without it there would be way less powered up items and much less income for the Frogs.

Quoted from "squirrlee;521746"

So a 200m item is actually 16'666'666 per player in a 12 man party.

I'd like to state that no ToSH HM gear sold in a group sell from our guild (Heretic) has been sold for anything above 100mil to date (give or take the odd 5mil), I even recall posting that we're selling for 50-100mil (depending on item) so I have no idea where you quoted '200mil from. Currently we're dropping our selling price (last boss drops going for 45-75mil and that's just to non-guildies). The 200mil item price bracket you're 'quoting' is either from your own server prices or from the inflation period when GCH items were being sold from anything between 150-300mil (naughty sellers! but then again dias were 60k per at the time)

Quoted from "squirrlee;521746"

My question is when the party is gearing in new content who is paying for these runs?

For our guild, the ones who run pay their own way through, to finance the runs many run sc to sell stats or RT to sell gear or run DoD for hours on end. The purpose of group selling for us is to cover the runs that are being carried out now.

Quoted from "squirrlee;521746"

Is the group only keeping the OD stuff and selling the dregs or are the OD items being used until an OD drops?

Please define 'Dregs'. I'm assuming you're referring to UD items, frankly I don't see how UD can be termed the dregs when people who are buying are only buying because they're unable to run the content in question. I certainly don't see my UD armour being a dreg as you class it.

Quoted from "squirrlee;521746"

The other thing is guilds are holding items and making false shortages to keep the price up and keep other parties from reaching farming ability and killing the price of the items.

Unless you're trying to say that guilds are 'holding' RT,ZS,DL gear (lets not forget the stepping stone of SC weapons) thus preventing other parties from reaching farming ability then I have no clue what you're talking about. As far as I'm aware every player who I've ran with in ToSH or GCH used RT/ZS/DL gear in order to farm the new content items. Who on earth came up with the theory that you can't farm ToSH HM or GCH without TOSH HM or GCH gear?

Our guild (Heretic) weren't the first guild to clear on Reni, since our clearance not one piece of item has been 'held' as you theorised to prevent other players from upgrading nor are we charging 200mil per item (even as I type this my guildie is trying to group sell a ToSH HM Mage Staff for 75mil).

Quoted from "maomiai;521776"

(even as I type this my guildie is trying to group sell a ToSH HM Mage Staff for 75mil).

WTB toon transfer to Reni lol. Govinda is still trying to sell that for 300m on AH
I'm a little confused about the "getting 4 million per person" thing when you're selling the gear for 50m or so. When somebody sells an item, does he/she divide the gold equally and share it with everyone?

And I think a large part of us thinking endgamers as charging too much for gear is because they always seem so rich. I see them buying dozens of pieces of gear and stats each worth tens, if not hundreds of millions of gold per piece. At 4m profit a run, it seems unlikely that you would be able to become so rich.

Quoted from "ruisen2000;521792"

WTB toon transfer to Reni lol. Govinda is still trying to sell that for 300m on AH
I'm a little confused about the "getting 4 million per person" thing when you're selling the gear for 50m or so. When somebody sells an item, does he/she divide the gold equally and share it with everyone?

And I think a large part of us thinking endgamers as charging too much for gear is because they always seem so rich. I see them buying dozens of pieces of gear and stats each worth tens, if not hundreds of millions of gold per piece. At 4m profit a run, it seems unlikely that you would be able to become so rich.

Yes that's how it is whoever is group selling the item takes out a small part for the unbinder they used then splits the gold with whoever was on the run that day. Any item you see in the ah for 100m+ from toshh is more than likely being group sold atleast in rq.

sadly pugs are fewer than they used to be.spent most of today wothout sucess tyring to find a group for rt and up

Wht is a PUG? I haven't seen one of those in a LONG time on Reni. Please explain what one is supposed to be (said with some major sarcasm in mind).

Quoted from "MegaMouseSEC;521809"

Wht is a PUG? I haven't seen one of those in a LONG time on Reni. Please explain what one is supposed to be (said with some major sarcasm in mind).

Pick up group .lol i finally got one just took all day

I gave up on PUGs in RoM. Most times if you can get one together, after the first wipe at least one will leave if not more.

I didn't read the whole thread yet, so forgive me if this has already been said. This is my personal solution to the problem:

Don't sell diamonds.
Don't buy AH gear.

I'm serious. I haven't bought but maybe two or three pieces of gear. Ever. I don't buy stats either. I will buy stuff once in a while if I get a great price and am a long way from farming it myself or feel impatient at the time. I would possibly consider selling diamonds once in a while if someone offered a great price. They rarely do, so I keep my diamonds, and farm my own gear. What business is it of mine what price other people pay or charge for diamonds or gear?! Let them do as they please. If you can't agree on a price that makes you both happy, don't go through with the transaction. Why is this so difficult to understand?

BJ this is how it is. You may ahve a total of maybe 100 (probably less) people who will sell diamonds. Within that bunch you will ahve maybe half that are regular sellers. The competition for buyers can become quite hectic. Due to some of us on Reni driving the diamoond prices to the ground we now have them between 25k and 35k gold per diamond. Sometimes you will hear someone that is not a regular seller attempting to get 60k+ per diamonds but that is becoming more rare. We did this in an attempt to get the AH prices under control, but there are still some idiots out there that feel they can gouge the other players on gear. My advice to anyone looking in the AH is to look at these things after looking at the price:
1 Is the item OD or not?
2 Is the item statted or not? (I prefer to stat my own gear)
3 How many of said item is in the AH? (this is most important with mana stones than any other item).
4 How hard is it to actualy get certian items? (some endgamers feel they are privilidged and ask outrageous prices for things).
5 Can you get a group up for the instance that has the item youa re looking for?
6 Is the item plussed or not?


Otco for example is one of the endgamers that I can trust. There are a few others but not many.
Oe other thing I have seen that disturbs me is this: since the introduction of the stat removal items in the item mall, more and more gear is getting stuck into the AH with NO stats. Although the person who did that might have wanted that certian stat I feel they ahve devalued the item and its price should reflect that (lower than even a piece that is not OD).

Quoted from "MegaMouseSEC;521884"

BJ this is how it is. You may ahve a total of maybe 100 (probably less) people who will sell diamonds. Within that bunch you will ahve maybe half that are regular sellers. The competition for buyers can become quite hectic. Due to some of us on Reni driving the diamoond prices to the ground we now have them between 25k and 35k gold per diamond. Sometimes you will hear someone that is not a regular seller attempting to get 60k+ per diamonds but that is becoming more rare. We did this in an attempt to get the AH prices under control, but there are still some idiots out there that feel they can gouge the other players on gear. My advice to anyone looking in the AH is to look at these things after looking at the price:
1 Is the item OD or not?
2 Is the item statted or not? (I prefer to stat my own gear)
3 How many of said item is in the AH? (this is most important with mana stones than any other item).
4 How hard is it to actualy get certian items? (some endgamers feel they are privilidged and ask outrageous prices for things).
5 Can you get a group up for the instance that has the item youa re looking for?
6 Is the item plussed or not?


Otco for example is one of the endgamers that I can trust. There are a few others but not many.
Oe other thing I have seen that disturbs me is this: since the introduction of the stat removal items in the item mall, more and more gear is getting stuck into the AH with NO stats. Although the person who did that might have wanted that certian stat I feel they ahve devalued the item and its price should reflect that (lower than even a piece that is not OD).

How does removing the stat devalue the item? You would have needed 6 stones minimum anyways, this saves you from having to find a duplicate stat or making a clean stone.

On Reni, people think that 50-70mil on last boss ToSH drops is expensive. No matter how much you sell for, people will complain. 'Nuff said.

Quoted from "Ravesden;521910"

On Reni, people think that 50-70mil on last boss ToSH drops is expensive. No matter how much you sell for, people will complain. 'Nuff said.

No matter what you do nobody will ever be happy.

Simple solution: If you think AH prices are too high, don't buy it. If you think diamond prices are too high/low, don't buy/sell them.

Approves Ravesden comment 100% , people will complain no matter what ;-(
Approves Borella Comment 100%: [COLOR=black !important]Simple solution: If you think AH prices are too high, don't buy it. If you think diamond prices are too high/low, don't buy/sell them.[/COLOR]


So when i want to sell diamonds at my price can people stop whispering to complain please and just those who want to buy whisper me tyvm ;-).

Here is my reasoning for saying that removing a stat from something devalues it: the thinking by those that sell gear for outrageous prices are removing the stats to also stick them into the AH on mana stones. By doing this then posting the now unstatted piece for more than what it is now worth, and the mana stone for a far unrealistic price also, they are screwing the community. The stat removal tool is and will always be a bad idea due to the moneygrubbers on ALL servers. Why would anyone in their right mind want to buy a piece of gear with no stats for more thana piece with one stat?? Noone in their right mind would do that (but of course there are a buinch of nuts around that ahve way too much gold and just have to have a nice shiny new piece of gear). If a piece of gear has no stats it depreciates the value by a certian percentage. If you are so moneyhungry then go solo a few dungeons and sell teh drops like I do, don't try to scrrew the rest of the server over your lazyness.

For heavens sakes just buy the piece with a stat on it and stop complaining about non stat pieces. Essentially what your not including in your post is the fact that most items sold have crap stats (dex/pdef int/pdef etc etc) so you have to dish out the extra gold/dias to get it cleaned. Thats why they are cheaper... cause the seller knows you will have to clean the item.

Dunno about your server but on Artemis when a piece of gear has a high value stat IT IS HEAVILY REFLECTED IN THE AH PRICE. So stat removers are doing people a favor who prefer farming their stats over paying the inflated AH price.

Also stop buying stuff off the AH and wisper the sellers with REASONABLE offers, don't try and under cut but most people will drop the AH price 10-20% since they know the AH is already taking a cut.

Most of the time if a piece of gear is on the AH is overpriced for a reason other then greed "most of the time"

The reason its put at a high price is because the seller simply does not know what the item is worth and is expecting to get whispers with offers. 90% of the stuff I sell is for 40% or better then what I list it for because I get whispered "hey ill give you xxxx gold or yyyy diamonds for your chest piece of awesomeness".

If you see something on the ah for a ridiculous price and think that's the price the seller expects, your a maroon. You should consider talking to the seller, and don't be a DB about it just ask "hey, will you lower your price" or "hey, ill offer you XXX"

and if they truly do expect that high price then move on, don't whine and cry like a sissy lala girl over it. Man up, be patient, DoD and RT can still be farmed without GCH and ToSH gear, thats all you QQers do with it anyway...

Quoted from "MegaMouseSEC;521926"

Here is my reasoning for saying that removing a stat from something devalues it: the thinking by those that sell gear for outrageous prices are removing the stats to also stick them into the AH on mana stones. By doing this then posting the now unstatted piece for more than what it is now worth, and the mana stone for a far unrealistic price also, they are screwing the community. The stat removal tool is and will always be a bad idea due to the moneygrubbers on ALL servers. Why would anyone in their right mind want to buy a piece of gear with no stats for more thana piece with one stat?? Noone in their right mind would do that (but of course there are a buinch of nuts around that ahve way too much gold and just have to have a nice shiny new piece of gear). If a piece of gear has no stats it depreciates the value by a certian percentage. If you are so moneyhungry then go solo a few dungeons and sell teh drops like I do, don't try to scrrew the rest of the server over your lazyness.

This question I can answer:

Because the gear that has no stat on it is frequently being bought for high OD purposes, and the buyer can stat it any way they may wish. Gear sold with stats is often sold with undesirable stats on it that then have to be cleaned off, in addition to tiering, plusing, drilling and runing the gear itself.

In the long run it is actually cheaper to buy with no stats than it is with stats. Gear that has a desirable stat, high durability and is already tiered is going to sell for a fortune, because the work was done to obtain and tier the gear.

Quoted from "LadyMacV;521936"

This question I can answer:

Because the gear that has no stat on it is frequently being bought for high OD purposes, and the buyer can stat it any way they may wish. Gear sold with stats is often sold with undesirable stats on it that then have to be cleaned off, in addition to tiering, plusing, drilling and runing the gear itself.

In the long run it is actually cheaper to buy with no stats than it is with stats. Gear that has a desirable stat, high durability and is already tiered is going to sell for a fortune, because the work was done to obtain and tier the gear.

Yep.

It's not like your going to add 5 stats to a piece with dex/mdef or int/def right? having it clean saves you a step therefor making it more valuable.