Runes of Magic US / AU

Quoted from "dexhunterz;561935"

Siege should never be a reason for the buffing or nerfing of a class. This is a PVE game with 1 hour of PVP (Assuming you arent stuck on Grimdal or Indigo). Don't like how Scout stacks up against Rogue in SIege? Make a P/S for siege like everyone else

Good point , I should have ask every 1 to reroll to scout/x during chapter 3 .

Quoted from "dexhunterz;561935"

Siege should never be a reason for the buffing or nerfing of a class. This is a PVE game with 1 hour of PVP (Assuming you arent stuck on Grimdal or Indigo). Don't like how Scout stacks up against Rogue in SIege? Make a P/S for siege like everyone else

a p/s vs a scout? lolol c'mon mann get with the program, the best s/k's are using mdef stats + buffs now and can take out a p/s easily. ex. kanu. ugo into seige with 100-200k mdef thats jsut enoughto kill that p/s first without dieing add 2 healers and you're invincible unless the healers are killed.

y

Quoted from "arvis21;561945"

If anyone here does play s/x u should know that apart from the 1sec gcd. There is also delay time between certain skills.
if u use combo shot, u have to wait for the 1sec gcd, and on top of that u have to wait for the graphic (aka rising the range weapon up again for the next skill example: vampire arrow, reflective shot, etc).
r/s elite skill weak spot doesn't have that problem with using either reflective or vamp arrow.
if they work on the delay between skill, that would already give scout a boost in dmg.

Exactly, since wind arrow is a total waste of tp, I find lots of pauses in my rotation eating on shot to cd.is say either buff scouts dmg or eliminate the cd on shot. It would improve pve and PvP. Not too concerned with PvP until they fix p/s . Not worth right now. Or they could make WA a more viable skill

Also I think scouts are less viable now than they were in chp 2. I'm thinking of Soles

Quoted from "dexhunterz;561935"

Siege should never be a reason for the buffing or nerfing of a class. This is a PVE game with 1 hour of PVP (Assuming you arent stuck on Grimdal or Indigo). Don't like how Scout stacks up against Rogue in SIege? Make a P/S for siege like everyone else

Siege is not the reason for buffing or nerfing scouts (scouts are fine in pvp)... everyone is saying they are behind quite a bit in PVE dps right now. A lot of the best scouts in ppk have started going rogue because they can nearly double their dps that way. Those scouts you see keeping up on the scrut are only doing that because they out gear the rogues in party by a lot, or the rogue had a bad burn.

and this crap about scouts being ranged so they should have less dps because of survivability is just dumb. Rogues can stack massive amounts of dodge (VN cape/Evasion) and become nearly unhitable. So yea scouts should being doing comparable dps.

I think the main issue right now comes down to the extreamly low %dps scout skills have. you compare them to other physical damage classes and while scouts have 200-300% DPS on their semi spammable skills rogues, warriors, wardens and champions are running around with 500-700% spammables. Frankly I think every scout skill should see an 100%-150% dps added on.

Also while other physical dps classes get a stat increase from their favorite attribute scouts get nothing but a straight 1 PA from dex and str.

Yeah, I agree, was just saying bringing up siege in a "buff this/nerf this" post, shouldnt be allowed Not that S/R is the best dps in the first place, but even going rt on it I notice the big drop-off in dps. Honestly, Scouts got overnerfed in ch.4 Only instead of getting what the wardens got ( We will fix it next week), they got nothing at all. As long as they dont make shot or vamp arrows stronger (X/S is strong enough as it is), I see justification for making Scouts do more comparable dps. "Range" is an advantage over melee, but if a class is dps, then its dps. Melee classes have skills that combat the fact they arent ranged i.e. Evasion/Substitute/Chain gear/Defensive Formation/Whatever else there is.

Scouts should do less damage than warriors and rogues in pve because they get to attack from farther away.

Quoted from "Winston;562690"

Scouts should do less damage than warriors and rogues in pve because they get to attack from farther away.

I don't understand how range gives an advantage in boss fights, since the tank is taking the damage anyway.

Quoted from "ruisen2000;562695"

I don't understand how range gives an advantage in boss fights, since the tank is taking the damage anyway.

Have you run tosh yet? There is a ton of aoe damage and a scout and mage can stay well out of that range. Same with a lot of the AC bosses. When you heal you tend to see the damage output and who takes it.

Quoted from "Winston;562707"

Have you run tosh yet? There is a ton of aoe damage and a scout and mage can stay well out of that range. Same with a lot of the AC bosses. When you heal you tend to see the damage output and who takes it.

Nope. Never ran those before.

Quoted from "Winston;562690"

Scouts should do less damage than warriors and rogues in pve because they get to attack from farther away.

rogues get numerous counters to protect them in a melee environment... cant speak for wars since I never played one. Either way scouts should be near a rogue or wars dps not 30-40% behind.

Also scouts are made incredibly squishy by blood arrow and since its now on a 2min cd you cant use it as strategically for different stages of a boss fight.

They could always just buff Archers glory back to 20% attack speed 15% dmg increase. That would give them the much needed dps boost for boss fights. Though the 80% movement reduction is already a huge issue in tosh and AC where you need to be moving in almost all of the boss fights.

Quoted from "Cronrs;562825"

rogues get numerous counters to protect them in a melee environment... cant speak for wars since I never played one. Either way scouts should be near a rogue or wars dps not 30-40% behind.

Also scouts are made incredibly squishy by blood arrow and since its now on a 2min cd you cant use it as strategically for different stages of a boss fight.

They could always just buff Archers glory back to 20% attack speed 15% dmg increase. That would give them the much needed dps boost for boss fights. Though the 80% movement reduction is already a huge issue in tosh and AC where you need to be moving in almost all of the boss fights.

Warriors have 20% AoE reduction from ZS/DL set skill.

Quoted from "Winston;562707"

Have you run tosh yet? There is a ton of aoe damage and a scout and mage can stay well out of that range. Same with a lot of the AC bosses. When you heal you tend to see the damage output and who takes it.

actually, most of the aoe damage dealt in tosh and AC is pretty random. everyone can get hit. regardless if your are melee or ranged. (e.g. the piercing shot from tosh 1st boss; those fire dots from last boss in AC; the falling rocks at boss #4 in tosh and so on)

range is an advantage when fighting big trashmob packs but even there you can evade everything as a melee class. for most bosses you dont get a big benefit from being ranged dd.

just what i experienced...

Sixth boss ToSh: you don't have to dance in and out of the range of big leeway/burst bash. Being ranged is for sure an advantage there.

And mob pulls of course.. melee die all the time on mob pulls because of the aoe damage, but mages and scouts can just sit back and kill.

Quoted from "Borella;562904"

Sixth boss ToSh: you don't have to dance in and out of the range of big leeway/burst bash. Being ranged is for sure an advantage there.

erm its been a while since the 6th boss got a chance to use leeway/burst in runs iv been in. But either way most decent dps groups can just serenstrum/cake the first and substitute the 2nd.

mob pulls ya you have to know the PBaoe to watch out for but that does not really decrease dps unless your just really bad.

There is definitely some justification for a ranged class dealing slightly less DPS than a melee class. Given the option of dealing X damage from near or far away, anyone would choose far away. Any time you have to "dance" around to avoid something, you aren't in melee range and therefore can't be dealing damage. For a range character, whether or not you need to avoid something, you're still doing nearly full damage since there is nothing stopping you from using instant attacks. Any time you have to use a defensive skill or item, it's an activation/GCD that could have been used on a damage skill.

It comes down to a simple question of how much. After Chapter 4, IMO, scouts were fine for the most part. You could complain about specific combos like S/M, S/P, and S/D, but every class has a few red-headed step children and the scout ones were certainly better than the worst hybrids out there like W/D. S/Wd, S/R, and S/W (even S/K was doing pretty well up til the disarm change) were in the ballpark of 10-20% behind the top melee classes. This comes down to some developers thinking that a reform of GCD was a great idea (if done differently, it might have been) without taking *any* consideration for the fact that it would effect some classes far more than others. 2h warriors lost ~15% of the activations in their rotation, S/Wd lost ~35% of their activations, S/X lost ~20-25% of their activations, and of course any magic user was buried.

Of course, scouts and 2h warriors didn't have those changes rolled back. Now you have a bunch of scout combos that were viable and are mostly just outside of viable now. S/R still has a strong niche to fill, and S/Wd is probably close enough that all they have to do is be a slightly better player or have slightly better gear to be worth taking along, but the rest...

Quoted from "sshades;562915"

There is definitely some justification for a ranged class dealing slightly less DPS than a melee class. Given the option of dealing X damage from near or far away, anyone would choose far away. Any time you have to "dance" around to avoid something, you aren't in melee range and therefore can't be dealing damage. For a range character, whether or not you need to avoid something, you're still doing nearly full damage since there is nothing stopping you from using instant attacks. Any time you have to use a defensive skill or item, it's an activation/GCD that could have been used on a damage skill.

well the devs are definitely blurring the lines between the whole "ranged should be less dps" idea since they just gave rogues stronger ranged attacks then most scouts have. Not to mention you can move while using combo throw because its an instant but you cant move while using combo shot even though its supposed to be an instant as well.

I actively play a scout as well as my rogue side and i can say i dont even go to ToSH as a Scout because whats the point when rogue side with grafu dagger vs my tosh bow does WAY more DPS. If i could ask for a buff it would probably be to our passive weapon skill increasing it from 30% damage gain to 65-70% like all the other classes and might just make Scouts more endgame viable with DPS and can keep up with warriors and rogues. But i also know if they do that the ammount of QQ the siegers will have cause we hit harder.

Quoted from "xMagus;563011"

I actively play a scout as well as my rogue side and i can say i dont even go to ToSH as a Scout because whats the point when rogue side with grafu dagger vs my tosh bow does WAY more DPS. If i could ask for a buff it would probably be to our passive weapon skill increasing it from 30% damage gain to 65-70% like all the other classes and mightjust make Scouts more endgame viable with DPS and can keep up with warriors and rogues. But i also know if they do that the ammount of QQ the siegers will have cause we hit harder.

Best idea so far IMO. The fact that our weapon dmg is half and our skills are half the dmg % its a miracle we keep up at all.

Quoted from "erablazer;563129"

Best idea so far IMO. The fact that our weapon dmg is half and our skills are half the dmg % its a miracle we keep up at all.

Well in pve they dont keep up, especially on boss fights. Just about every boss fight in tosh the w/r and r/s where doing nearly twice the damage of our s/wd and s/r in party. Dont think im going to bother with scouts in pve until they improve their damage.