Runes of Magic US / AU

Quoted from "gigilomann;573839"

So, I hae this theory, that if you RESRICT 1 recon per class ( main hand only) and 1 hatred only that it would fix the gameplay, rather than having to continue to revamp skills.

Point 1. This would remove the burn for the "most part" a tank with 1 hatred X and dps with 1 recond X they would be forced to watch aggro and watch what skills they use and actually have a rotation rather than maximizing dps due to the tank with only 1 hatred. Tanks would be required to use skill and skills to hold aggro.

Point 2. This would make tanks and dps rely on more skills than burn/dps.

Point 3. anyone could play any class and as long as your pa/ma meet the soft cap it wouldnt matter what class you play b/c the burn would be out of the question so classes would hae to watch aggro and watch how much dps they output therefore top dps wouldn't matter.

Point 4. Mages: you'll have a rotation.

Just my theory not sur ehow it would work. reply your thoguhts! thanks.

I can see this cause a lot of QQ against Mages, since a huge amount of mages only get 1 recon anyway. This change will not affect a lot of mages at all. We'll keep burning with Recon +Unharmed (Set skill, -30% aggro) + -aggro food. And the game would be renamed "Runes of Sad R/S".

Also, the reason that we don't have a rotation during burn phase is due to cast time, not aggro issues. We can only cast as fast as .5 sec, so anything that has less than 3 second cast time should go below 0.5s cast, but still be stuck at .5 cast time. So the extra casting speed buffs are wasted.

K/P is the best tank at holding aggro. And it has 1 weapon slot only.

Eh do anything ToSH+ and you won't see as many burns anyway. They end up as sustained fights with plenty of strat and skill required.

Also how will restricting 1 recon magically create a mage rotation, most mages can only use 1 recon already. Would have to readjust all mage skills to make that happen (which I wouldn't be against).

yeah because instances are too easy, how was last boss KBN HM?

how was 4th?...


you know just assuming you've done it multiple times to even suggest making it harder

First off....They ripped Knights off with the supposed "Balancing".......Then they give plate to Wdn/w and W/k.....and if that wasn't enough they go and bring Champion into the game and Give it a Weapon Mastery. Do you really want the current Knights that are K/s to leave too? Sure have everyone screaming at the tanks because they can't hold aggro because that is who will take the blame. Many DPSers can't look at anything besides Scrut now you think that it's going to be any different with a change like this?

I'm not a K/s but I will argue this for those that are......I call PURE Bull Manure on this idea/theory. Do you even play a Tank, are you aware of how few tanks there are left in the game? Sheesh I remember back in ch3 when my guild had 4 tanks and we couldn't take more that 2 at the most on runs and were short on healers strong enough to do more than one run at a time. I know several players that went to DPS because they were just waiting around as a tank. Tanks a few and far between why would you want to run them off? Very few people like playing a tank class and with knight you have really no choice but to tank because you can't do any real damage to be considered a decent dps aside form even the gimped K/w. Warden can play as DPS rather easy and I'm not sure if Champ can or not but they have to be better than a knight as DPS.



Watch this will be the one "Idea" they take and use. If they do I hope they call it the Gigilomann Patch and everyone hunts you down and your guild kicks you out and you become an outcast.

Quoted from "squirrlee;573849"

Watch this will be the one "Idea" they take and use. If they do I hope they call it the Gigilomann Patch and everyone hunts you down and your guild kicks you out and you become an outcast.

Lol! This was priceless.

There are very simple ways to balance pve, and it requires data mining. Basically take the dps data from the top 5 dps of each class combo across all servers, do all the stats mumbo jumbo, central limit thrm etc etc and you get a bunch of normally distributed dps curves for burn and post burn. If for some odd reason you don't get normalized data, do that Z mumbojumbo and voila you can now stack up dps btw classes and really compare. Then make balancing tweaks and check back with new data every week/2 weeks.

Now there are many ways to go from here, I'll just list a couple...starting from the easiest:

1. Tweak coefficients for skills and that's the simple way to balance pve. BUT, this will affect pvp!

2. So instead of tweaking coefficients, how about chaining more skills to force rotations like rogues and warriors have. So let's say x/y class combo has a burn dps that's within like .5 st dev of the mean of all class combo dps, but a post-burn dps that's at like 1.5 st devs lower, make a 5 skill m/wl rotation that applies debuffs in a certain order that procs on the final skill. These debuffs won't apply to players.

3. ok well could just keep listing things, but you get the picture.

PvP is a whole different beast since it's about cc, vision, range, and a whole lot of other variables outside of a simple dps response variable.

If a class combo somehow finds an exploit, the data will tell the story and alert developers who can then fix dat #$%$

PvE balancing is flat out easy as mom's apple pie...

1 more thing, dps isn't the onlything for PvE, i just oversimplified, mages, for example, have great CC and aoe dps that w/wd or w/r or r/s or s/wd or wd/s don't have, so they simply shouldn't have as much single target dps. Could work on making m/x and wl/x class combos and move then down an aoe/cc path, single target dps path, bleed/buff/debuff path, and do the same with some physical dps combos. Then you obviously wouldn't compare a aoe dps class combo with the dps of a single dps class combo.

Cheers

With all due respect, this is a HORRIBLE idea. Anyone that has played a mage or any other high aggro class would realize that even ONE flame can and will pull aggro away from the tank and on to you. Having 1 hatred for the tank would make this even worse. I have reached 150% aggro even WITH my recon in (Not negative aggro but +150%) and the tank had 3 hatred X's.

Also trying mages are only viable in instances BECAUSE of their "burn". So trying to force a "rotation" on a class that doesn't have one would just make all the newer boss fights even worse.

And honestly, I think RW has done a decent job reducing burns in the first boss of many of the newer instances. First boss Sardo is not burnable, first boss TOSH interupts your burn at every 20% or so, first boss AC was not supposed to be burned, the tornados were meant to keep you focused and moving a bit, though it didn't work. And first boss KBN-H is not burnable as far as I know, b/c he has so much freaking HP that even with full burn, it still takes forever to kill that guy.

While bosses after that may be burnable, if you can't do strat for first boss, you're not going to do the bosses after that.

Also, people lose items everytime changes like these are made. People lost runes when they fixed duping, and people lost random extractors when they accidently made back to being unstackable again. if RW makes what you're suggesting, a can see a lot of people losing their second/third Recon/Hatred.

Quoted from "gigilomann;573839"

So, I hae this theory, that if you RESRICT 1 recon per class ( main hand only) and 1 hatred only that it would fix the gameplay, rather than having to continue to revamp skills.

Point 1. This would remove the burn for the "most part" a tank with 1 hatred X and dps with 1 recond X they would be forced to watch aggro and watch what skills they use and actually have a rotation rather than maximizing dps due to the tank with only 1 hatred. Tanks would be required to use skill and skills to hold aggro.

Point 2. This would make tanks and dps rely on more skills than burn/dps.

Point 3. anyone could play any class and as long as your pa/ma meet the soft cap it wouldnt matter what class you play b/c the burn would be out of the question so classes would hae to watch aggro and watch how much dps they output therefore top dps wouldn't matter.

Point 4. Mages: you'll have a rotation.

Just my theory not sur ehow it would work. reply your thoguhts! thanks.

+1 , but why you talk about mages? r/s mr.3recons class will be more affected

you would have to a) revamp everything that generates or mitigates aggro b) change nearly every boss fight after Raskha Temple to fit into a game where the fight is not getting uglier after a couple of seconds so making the fight last considerably longer does not really matter - instead of causing every minimalistic mistake of any one person in the raid to either kill himself,someone else or even the group. best example: b1,b2 tosh hard. any boss in RT hardmodes at the supposed level. grafu hard b3. etc etc

thats simply not going to happen. and dont get me started on the topic of runewaker and their mathematical capabilities, it'll only make me rage.

It's a bit like that:

[video=youtube;rp8hvyjZWHs]Trust me, i'm an engineer[/video]

Everybody should be happy to receive balancing from such an engineer!

+1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 to Yoman hahahaha shows all the effort Runewaker puts in the design of the game lolllll.

You have made my day ;-))

Yeah, I love it when Yoman uses pics and videos to get his point accross. lol +1 to Yoman. Did we mention that you are awesome?

//offtopic
The only problem is to get the damn earworm out of my head, im actually singing it all day now -.-
And btw: once i finally finished college after probably 100 years, i will be an engineer, too ... this video kinda makes me worry lol.

*Trust me,i'm an engineer - with epic skill and epic gear* ....

scary stuff isnt it .
*trust me im a priest -with epic skill and epic gear*

The easiest way to stop the burn phase would be to just make cooldowns that you cannot use, like ones that would kill you or make you unable to move.

Quoted from "Amberwave;573933"

The easiest way to stop the burn phase would be to just make cooldowns that you cannot use, like ones that would kill you or make you unable to move.

playing scout, when u use archer's glory, blood arrow, and if ur s/w, berserk, you are pretty much committing suicide against the wrong boss...u might as well just tank the boss urslf for all the good it will do you...
making more cooldowns which have a safety hazard like this may reduce the chance of full burns, while the really skilled players will still be able to use their cooldowns more stategically

I don't think they should change this, mostly because I don't think it would matter and would just upset people. I mostly see 2 classes of tanks. The ones that have so much aggro (and with only 1 hatred) it wouldn't matter if the DPS didn't have any recons... or the ones with such little aggro, it wouldn't matter if they had 5 hatred Xs and the DPS all had negative aggro.

Also, I don't think boss burns have really been a problem since ch3 with the RT diamond immune tanking/burns. Since then, the new instances haven't been burns until after you have already done them several times and have the new gear/stats from them -- at which point, they should be burns IMO, because I don't want 20 minute boss fights after I've already done them 100+ times and I'm just there doing spam for stats or helping others gear up. It would suck if a brand-new instance was so easy it was a burn when it first comes out, yah, but if it only becomes a burn after 100+ runs, well great! I think most of the people that complain about burns are the ones that are behind, and don't get to the new instances until a few months after they are released, and then are upset they are burns (only because others in the party are already over-geared for it). That's fine if you can't always get to them right when they come out, but if you want to do them the strat method that late in the game, you'll need to find others that are behind as well, and run it with them.