Runes of Magic US / AU

Quoted from "Quaffy2;596831"

Umm, did you even read my post there, you make arguments about things that i didnt even mention.

And please show me a mage who while questing uses flame to kill all the mobs or farm (and nothing else). Mages happen to have more skills than the cast time flame, which is a part of why they are so useful farming: several instants, aoes, stuns, etc. Priest has none of that, just rising tide, which they would have to sit there stationary using the entire time while questing.

Yes it makes a huge difference and increases the amount of time everything takes. Never said priest couldnt kill mobs, it just takes FOREVER and you have to stay in one spot getting hit/interrupted/kncoked down the whole time. Being able to move while attacking (not casting, i didn't ask for that) and firing off instants is kinda important and saves time. And yeah prett much every game I've played included casters with instant spells (that don't require them to stand stationary the entire time if they want to kill something).

And yeah the scout nerf, they were able to spam shot at the speed of their ping and burn bosses that no other dps class could do (or even get invited to), very nice comparison to p/s, lol.

Jester will always go back to Scouts, even though it is so ridiculously different from the P/S nerf that it has no place whatsoever in this discussion. Until someone shows me a video of 12 P/S's burning through KBH, or hell a guild entirely of P/S's in siege, that argument is 100% invalid.

Just give up. He'll never understand why the nerf was unnecessary.

Quoted from "Quaffy2;596831"

Umm, did you even read my post there, you make arguments about things that i didnt even mention.

And please show me a mage who while questing uses flame to kill all the mobs or farm (and nothing else). Mages happen to have more skills than the cast time flame, which is a part of why they are so useful farming: several instants, aoes, stuns, etc. Priest has none of that, just rising tide, which they would have to sit there stationary using the entire time while questing.

Yes it makes a huge difference and increases the amount of time everything takes. Never said priest couldnt kill mobs, it just takes FOREVER and you have to stay in one spot getting hit/interrupted/kncoked down the whole time. Being able to move while attacking (not casting, i didn't ask for that) and firing off instants is kinda important and saves time. And yeah prett much every game I've played included casters with instant spells (that don't require them to stand stationary the entire time if they want to kill something).

And yeah the scout nerf, they were able to spam shot at the speed of their ping and burn bosses that no other dps class could do (or even get invited to), very nice comparison to p/s, lol.

Editing to remove childish comments, cause i am bigger than that.

People drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

How does moving "reduce the time to kill something?" Only time that is true is interrupts/stuns. And a lot of those can hit you at range, so how does that make ANY difference.

Which games? Please name some that have casting classes with no casting time abilities?

ON this thread there as been multiple mages that agreed to using flame, especially in MT with mobs with 200k+ health.

I know people dont like healing priests should heal.. but does it shock you that Priests arent as effective killers as others classes? Really? I was shocked in Rift that clerics were equal DPS cause it wasnt what a "priest" in ANY RPG has been like

Editing to remove childish comments, cause i am bigger than that.

People drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Editing to remove childish comments, cause i am bigger than that.

People drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Your numbers are wrong and just plain everywhere and your missing out on what quaffy said.

Learn mechanics of the game.

Quoted from "pwnsnoobs;596843"

Your numbers are wrong and just plain everywhere and your missing out on what quaffy said.

Learn mechanics of the game.

If my numbers are wrong could you please post the right ones? What Quaffy said has nothing to do with the numbers. I didnt miss it, i didnt care.

Quoted from "pwnsnoobs;596833"

Somebody clearly died from p/s too much.

Many people died from P/s, rogues, warriors, knights, scouts etc, if a class can't kill then the class is pointless. Redesign the game so healers gain xp when healing and they may not mind not being able to heal. Hmmm, maybe a good 'attack' for a healer would be having the last dozen heals undone for their opponent.

Responses in boldface

Quoted from "Dkjester;596797"

I think a focus cost still isnt great... here is why

1) You all have commented how the nerf KILLED the class PVE... how does a focus cost fix that. Especially if you all claim how "focus comes back so slow". It would still kill the class PVE.... Like you said it was better to IB a mob which still took forever, but was better than rising tide.... Well the focus cost would STILL make you have to wait for focus. Therefore that doesnt fix the arguement that this nerf killed it in PVE... Unless you wanna concede that PVE really isnt the point of wanting it unnerfed... Which i have been saying from the beginning.

I'd like to say at the start that since Ice Blades was gutted, I've done the minigames as S/P, not P/S. The main reason for that is the timing issues with Survival Game, Course of Terror, and Goblin Games. As a P/S I would be unable to complete either SG or CoT within the time limit for the former, and within each of the rounds for the latter. I *might* be able to complete GG, but I'm not willing to risk the loss of 30 tokens to find out. I'll describe further at the end of the post.


2) PVP it would adjust a balance, if it was ONLY to have a Focus costs in PVP, it of course might be as effective but would not affect PVE... In fact IMO 3 sec cool down for PVE is way better than "7 IB... wait 5 min to 7 IB again" It will also not affect the part that you could still spam 7 of them and kill someone with no skill, it just means you wouldnt be able to cut through a group of people with it. So doesnt really address the problem.

The reason why a focus cost for IB in Siege or PvP is *barely* acceptable is that while doing PvE questing or farming, you don't move a heckuva lot. And as someone else said, in PvE most P/S players would use RT > IB > IB et cetera to kill mobs. RT is a good opener and at least for me, does more damage than IB does because it's a *cast time* skill, not an instant. Damage from RT scales up for each second of cast time. Ask any Mage about the difference between Flame and Fireball, and the amount of damage each one does.

In PvP, especially in Siege, a P/S simply does NOT have the time to stand there, regardless of the tier of a Raid rune in his staff--presuming he has one--without getting killed by another player with instant cast skills. It makes no difference at all if those skills are ranged or melee DPS or if it's another magic caster. Not to mention that if you're stupid enough to stand there like the Statue of Liberty, you *will* be targeted and killed. So, you need to be mobile. (And standing in one spot, using UH to keep yourself alive is *not* an option for a mage-statted P/S. This I *know* to be a fact from painful personal experience.)

With a focus cost to IB, a mobile P/S would rapidly run out of focus, and not be able to regenerate it quickly enough to *continue* to be effective.


That is why i say a dmg nerf in PVP (I would even say maybe only 25% reduction, not 25% of dmg, but 25% reduction) and then remove CD. That addresses PVE and PVP both more fairly.....

Again unless you want to retract that all the arguements about IB nerf killing PVE.... cause how does 7 IB then not being able to use it, make it any better than a 3 sec cool down for PVE... After all since Priests can heal themselves... they can heal between IBs and be better then not having it at all after 7....

Comments regarding a P/S in PvE:

Limiting the discussion to the minigames I mentioned above, prior to the gutting which IB received, I had no problem dealing with those games. The one which was the most difficult to complete within its multiple rounds was CoT. My attacks on the gate barriers were as follows: RT, then IB until the gate went down. For me, RT would do approximately 180K damage to the gate, and each IB would do around 120K, give or take, and the gate would go down in 5 seconds or so, give or take a second or two.

Now, with IB having a 3-second cooldown between casts, this won't work. Even changing the "rotation" (such as it is) to RT/IB/RT/IB, it would take longer to knock down the gates, and chances are very good that I would miss out on getting the special chests and/or the special keys for them. Even at level 70 as a Scout, I can take the gates down about as fast as I could as a 75/70 P/S with IB @ 75.

Now imagine waiting 3 seconds between hitting each of the devices *and* the guardian mobs in SG. Imagine having to wait 3 seconds to kill each of the worms and each of the goblins in GG.

And *you* want to tell *me* that IB having been gutted with a 3-second cooldown hasn't ruined the class in PvE?

Not only are you wrong, you're dead wrong.


Cause i dont think you exaggerate how long it takes for focus regen.

Since I've also played S/R and S/P (now), I *do* know how slowly focus regenerates when you're moving and using it for your skills. And don't just tell me to go buy focus regen pots. That's almost as insulting as telling me that I should just know my place, be a good little healer, and to forget about doing anything that resembles DPS.


Edit to add: 11k for rising tide 2 sec cast, 6-7 for 1 sec cast, 11k dps vs 12-14k dps... Looks like to me that using Rising tide isnt THAT much worse than spamming IB in PVE... which was another of my points why it didnt kill the class PVE.... That is assuming no curse runes in the staff... etc

Read my comments immediately above. And no, I've not tried killing mobs in MT as a P/S. I'm only suicidal in Siege.

Quoted from "Dkjester;596844"

If my numbers are wrong could you please post the right ones? What Quaffy said has nothing to do with the numbers.

Oh how I wish midknight were still around...

Quoted from "Dkjester;596844"

I didnt miss it, i didnt care.

That is the real problem here. You don't care to listen to anyone else. Rather than complaining to RW/GF to fix your class, you would rather whine until other people's classes are as broken as yours. Why not ask to have your class buffed up until things are more equal? But no, you would rather have someone else nerfed down to your level. Pathetic.

Quoted from "Borella;596716"

GH really means nothing at all. Not that hard to get a high GH.

Arynion.. oh are you that one who sold a ton of dias and bought all that gear a few months ago? Lol.

No wonder you don't understand game mechanics and thing Ice Blade was OP.

Any endgame P/K should know, just by how little Ice Blade actually hits a healer for, just how Un-OP it was.

Why yes, yes I was. And if you'd like to know Arynion has been in the game since Chapter 3, i played him until the end of chapter 4 and recently picked him up a couple months ago. He needed new gear, so I got him new gear. The problems with dropping your character for a few months.

Quoted from "Ravesden;596721"

No, you don't.

You have an average geared p/k. You're not end game by any means. Your GH is decent, your crit % is something I had when GCH was out with 90k hp.

I've been with, and ran with practically all current end game toons on Reni (yeh I get around). Putting on some cheap ass..embly of gear together and calling yourself "end game" is a joke. Pieces you mentioned are the easiest/cheapest to get, your crit % is less than decent for a healer at this point in the game. You should have ~75%. I'm currently at 77%.

All this coming from an end game healer. There are currently 8 (maybe 9, havent seen her on for awhile) end game P/K on Reni. You're not one of them.

Iceblade wasn't OP. Spammable, yes. Not OP. The nerf does not justify the previous viability of the skill. They should have added a 15 focus cost and left it at that. 3 second cooldown was too much.

The damage on it was a joke really. Most of the QQ bout the damage came from crap-geared players or the usual "QQ a preist kiled meh" morons.

Yes, I am aware my crit needs work, I have been counseled on gear and other things by other end-game healers in the game (I would rather not have to deal with you as your attitude is less than appealing, as shown in your post).

Quoted from "tmblake09;596861"

Yes, I am aware my crit needs work, I have been counseled on gear and other things by other end-game healers in the game (I would rather not have to deal with you as your attitude is less than appealing, as shown in your post).

That's fine. Chances are your avenues have, in one way or another, been "counseled" by yours truly.

Although I'm dubious as to if your "end-game healers" are actually real end-game healers.

Quoted from "tmblake09;596861"

Yes, I am aware my crit needs work, I have been counseled on gear and other things by other end-game healers in the game (I would rather not have to deal with you as your attitude is less than appealing, as shown in your post).

Raves was a perfectly nice fellow in vent. Just sayin.

Art of exaggeration is growing strong in young padawans. After all exaggerating everything is like a standard in rom and those without good enough exaggeration skills needs to be schooled with it before they are allowed to reply on forums....

It's also un-true that no endgamer ever whined on p/s, but probably not everyone are even bothering to post on forums or whine at every thing and it seems that p/s fanatics are eating any anti-p/s posters alive...

Another subject; How to define end-game player in runes of magic? I used to play some FPS game back in the time and people used to call noobs those kind of people who weren't skilled players. Once I moved to my first MMORPG, people used to call noobs those people without awesome shining armors plussed to their max regardless their skills. Since RoM is pretty much pay-to-win game as some people have mentioned here and there time to time. Maybe in rom we put skill and gear into hardon collider and get something mixed in between with DYICE added on top as little spice. It's just that I've seen some great promising players with a bad gear as well as played with couple people with an extremely fat wallet, whose names I'm not going to reveal. Watching some pay-to-win players play made it hard to breathe, it was like watching America's funniest home videos, but even more funny...

Then again what is endgame healer, as it goes to brag with gears? The awsome endgame pro healer must be then the person with all his gear HD word boss and newest instance, top memento gear, all at least t9 statted (and at max half of his gear minimum at t8 statted might be accebtable withn some budget exceptions) with at least 4 orange stats in each piece of course plussed all to +16. Weapons must be at least tier 12 or fully statted to tier 10. Everyone else are just average medigame noobs and their word mean absolutely nothing as average medigame nobbie players are no awesome endgamer pros. Now I sit back waiting for some soon to be my idol priests to post how playing is with full t10 statted gear now, and anyone else aka medinoblet is not eligible to post? But difference between many gear are very small and now even blue gear is close to equal to world boss gear? One is not endgame healer if he has 1k less stamina? I want to know what is endgamer...


Anyway, many of the other MMORPG games I've ever played, priests were the awesome OP class being able to do as much damage as anyone else even having some AOE at times, being only class having OP self-heals and nearly un-killable at least at some point of the game. Since priests keep comparing themselves to DPS classes selectively like comparing their weakest part against strongest parts of real dps. I want to suggest that we give rogues, warriors and scouts (and later to knight too for a balancing reasons) passive 60% healing bonus, self-heal and group heal, so we can finally kill priests completely off, because no-one wants priest who can't have awesome burst DPS because DEATHS cost hammers and tactics so hardy and why should DPS be only for DPS?

I've read bit around p/s threads on multiple sections and half of the posts at some points ended up p/s defending their class combo with a personal attacks. Originally I was planning to not write anything to these subjects, but there were couple points I felt small urge to add. Problem is that it would take way too long to write them so I don't feel like doing so, but I can say that they were all against p/s defenders, using their own words against them from now and from the past of the first p/s OP discussions which would put half of their own arguments on disadvatage. What goes around comes around? ...or gets lost in the midway.

Uh, long post without contributing much anything. Now I feel such an evil...

Quoted from "Malignatus;596851"

Responses in boldface

Mini Games... Ok so we know that it wont hurt average everyday hunting, though people said it would. Then someone said "OMG I ALMOST DIE" that is false also. Now you are using mini games??? I run mini games every day on my p/s characters. THey have 8k ma attk. Survival.. bone chill will kill the devices with a single hit with only 50 pts in it, and then will be enough to kill the mobs with a single bone chill.... Terror, RT works just fine killing gates, but after all you dont HAVE to kill anything if you are good at strat. Gobs? ok with 8k ma attk... my IB 1 shots mobs, Frost scars 1 shots mobs, chain of light first hit kills the mobs. Takes me 8 minutes to get through gobs on a again 8k ma attk priest! We do it 3 times a day on priests 2 p/s 1 p/r. The P/r is only level 65. So as the above poster said the problem is the p/s fanatics exaggerate to try to get their point over turned.

It is simple not true.

Skyfyre, you wish midknight was around cause....... you dont have the ability to crunch the numbers yourself? However you dont like the results and you are SURE if he was he would crunch them and get the answer you want?

I dont care what he says cause about it cause it has NOTHING to do with the numbers. NOTHING. P/s fanatics will keep trying to come up with exaggerations on why it is "broken pve" cause they want it fixed PVP. Plain and simple.

As Mal said:

The reason why a focus cost for IB in Siege or PvP is *barely* acceptable is that while doing PvE questing or farming, you don't move a heckuva lot. And as someone else said, in PvE most P/S players would use RT > IB > IB et cetera to kill mobs. RT is a good opener and at least for me, does more damage than IB does because it's a *cast time* skill, not an instant. Damage from RT scales up for each second of cast time. Ask any Mage about the difference between Flame and Fireball, and the amount of damage each one does.

And ... my MAIN character is a mage... i dont have to "ask anyone". Ruisen has said mages will mostly use flame on MT mobs. Mages have commented on it. It is just sad

Quoted from "SkyFyre;596867"

Raves was a perfectly nice fellow in vent. Just sayin.

Raves actually talks in vent? since when?

Quoted from "Dkjester;596872"

Skyfyre, you wish midknight was around cause....... you dont have the ability to crunch the numbers yourself? However you dont like the results and you are SURE if he was he would crunch them and get the answer you want?

Yeah, thats it exactly I of all people can't crunch numbers. He just does it much better, and is able to put an eloquent spin on telling you how wrong you are.

I also like how you ignore the biggest point of what I said: Instead of whining until others are nerfed down to your level, you should be asking to have your class buffed up to theirs.

FWIW, I don't even play p/s anymore.

Quoted from "SkyFyre;596875"

Yeah, thats it exactly I of all people can't crunch numbers. He just does it much better, and is able to put an eloquent spin on telling you how wrong you are.

I also like how you ignore the biggest point of what I said: Instead of whining until others are nerfed down to your level, you should be asking to have your class buffed up to theirs.

FWIW, I don't even play p/s anymore.

If you can crunch the numbers and you are so sure they are wrong, then you musta done some number crunching to prove it right? Or are you just firing from the hip with the "the numbers have to be wrong, cause they prove me wrong" attitude? If you did do ANY work to crunch the numbers or have any proof, why not put it here?

I HAVE A P/S, I HAVE 3 of them!!! How do you think i tested the numbers!?!?!?! Why does everyone try to make a point like i dont have one? They nerfed me too! Difference is i could see it was gonna get the nerf BEFORE it happened.

I really think people need to prove what they are saying. "I almost die", "I cant do the mini games", "your numbers are wrong"... you know what PROVE IT. Fraps it, show the number crunching. Very easy for you to prove it. Problem is you cant. I dare you to prove it, everyone making these comments not just Skyfyre. Put your money where your mouth is. Problem is RW musta tested it, knew it wouldnt break it, which is why you probably wont see a reverse.

LOL, this thread has gone down the drain....and here i was, actually posting something useful on the forums...all for naught...

Quoted from "Cike;596880"

LOL, this thread has gone down the drain....and here i was, actually posting something useful on the forums...all for naught...

Useful? hrm here i thought it was just a "i want my p/s fixed" thread... kinda requires you to prove it was broken first nah?

That is the problem with this thread... P/S players want everyone to accept they were broken and then just go from there. Problem is you were only broken in PVP. You failed to prove you were broken PVE.

HOw is that useful? Also if a nerf never gets un-done.. how USEFUL is this thread?

The fact the poll specifically doesnt have a "no change needed" shows the entire mentality of "assume we are broken and go from there mentality". Problem is you should have to prove you got broken and not just whine that you were.