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bleedingblak

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1

Monday, March 3rd 2014, 6:39am

Looking for physical damage formula (melee)

Anyone know the physical damage forumla / calculation?

Trying to figure out when I should be using patk food vs pdam food (when I have certain pdam cooldowns on like suicide advance / morale boost... etc)


~Fly into the distance, disappear for awhile~

2

Monday, March 3rd 2014, 6:54am

i feel like this has been a fruitless 4 year quest. been looking for it for a long long time and never found it. i did once find the equations for the old scouts, but those are very differnt.

bleedingblak

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3

Monday, March 3rd 2014, 7:37am

I've seen this

Magic Skill Damage Formula

Didn't test anything you have in this post, but wanted to give you an equation that has been tested time and again as the working mDmg calculation for RoM. Yours might be close to this info or even the same, no idea. Worked the last two days with no sleep and heading to bed, just popped on here and saw this thread... anyways... The last time I tested this one was May 8th, 2013

Quoted

Quoted





Quoted from "EntropyKnight;511497"




I know there have been several cases of upper-game mages feeling
neglected as archetypal crowd-control and utility combatant ever since
chapter III, due to their spells' negligible damage scaling. I propose
the following to potentially eliminate this problem:



Correct me if I'm wrong here but it seems as if calculations are as follows (or at least remarkably similar to):



Given:



D (Damage Output); MA (Magical Attack); PA (Physical Attack); MD (Target
Magical Defense); PD (Target Physical Defense); MDmg (Magical Damage);
PDmg (Physical Damage); SFact (Skill Damage Factor); DPSFact (DPS
Factor); CT (Casting Time); Atr (% Attribute Factor)



Magical: D = (MA/MD) * (CT * (MDmg + SFact)) + Atr

Physical: D = (PA/PD) * (CT * (DPSFact + SFact)) + Atr



Using these formulae it occurred to me that while the % Attribute Factor
is applied outside of Attack/Defense modifiers, the implementation of
these factors where they are in each formula doesn't grant the poor
mages much relief other than doing (assuming 10k intel on a 30% factor) a
mere 3k damage even if their Magical Attack is a colossus by
comparison to the target's Magical Defense. What I propose to this end
to ultimately balance the fact that a caster's skills will never be
able to functionally rely on their weapons' DPS', the individual skills
could perhaps be made to have a progressive % Attribute Factor and the
Magical Output formula reworked as follows;



D = (MA/MD) * (CT * (MDmg + SFact) + Atr) Or, alternatively for even greater output;

D = (MA/MD) * (CT * (MDmg + SFact + Atr))



--This second option would include the Casting Time multiplier on the %
Attribute Factor as well as applying the Attack/Defense modifier, as
opposed to only the Attack/Defense modifier.



The resulting implementations should at the very least, if a % Attribute
Factor were introduced into the full Mage's arsenal, amplify output to
hold them up to par for being a significant source of damage in
parties, as they appear to be originally intended.


~Fly into the distance, disappear for awhile~

4

Monday, March 3rd 2014, 6:34pm

EU forums sponsored by the legend Druffbaum

http://board.eu.runesofmagic.gameforge.c…ula#post3645541


Dmg_done = Crit_mod * ADF * [ 2.75 * DPS + 2 * DPS * Skill_percent ]

where

Crit_mod = 1 + 0.3 (base) + X (any other crit mods u have: rings-skills-buffs)

DPS = ( the damage on your character tab ) / ( weapon speed including speed buffs runes etc )

ADF is based on (your_patt) / (enemy_pdef) ratio:
ADF = { 0.1, if ratio < 0.2
ADF = { 0.5 * ratio, if 0.2 < ratio < 1
ADF = { 1 - 0.5/ratio , if ratio > 1


scout mechanics r similar, but not same. the ranged formula is changed to:

Dmg_done = Crit_mod * ADF * [ 2.75 * Damage + 2 * DPS * Skill_percent ]


i verify them from time to time along the patches to make sure tey still hold and RW doesnt make some ninja change. and yes, they still work as is.


ps: some side notes
- Casting time modifier on physical skills does not apply. So snipe would hit that same even if had 1sec or 3sec cast. Channeling skills are NOT cast skills (examples of channel-skills: Combo throw - combo shot etc etc).
- All AoE skill have an inherent 25-30% penalty. So a scout Piercing Arrow or a R/S Shadowstab (hits 2 targets = AoE = penalty) will hit 70% of what the formulas say.

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "achilleas1" (Mar 3rd 2014, 6:45pm)


5

Wednesday, April 23rd 2014, 5:57pm

I love that others are as interested in this as I am, I just don't understand the techno speak & abbreviations. it would be nice if someone could put this in language that even us simpletons could understand.

6

Wednesday, April 23rd 2014, 6:26pm

Dmg_done = Crit_mod * ADF * [ 2.75 * DPS + 2 * DPS * Skill_percent ] translating this, not doing tests to make sure its valid, i assume it is.

dmg_done = output. how much you deal to your target.

crit mod = crit damage for cits. im assuming 1 for non crit hits, crit damage for crit hits.

DPS is as described above. ( the damage on your character tab ) / ( weapon speed including speed buffs runes etc )

skill percent is shown in tool tip.

ADF is defined as follows.
Assume ypa is your physical attack and tpd is their physical defense

if (ypa/tpd) < 0.2
adf = 0 . 1
if 0.2 < (ypa/tpd) < 1
adf = 0.4(ypa/tpd)
if (ypa/tpd) > 1
1-0.5*ratio

so say for example, i have no speed buffs, 16000 weapon damage at 1.8 attack speed. my pattack is 100k pa, and my target has 60k pdef. i use a skill with 600% weapon damage, 150% crit damage.


output = 2.5* (0.5*100/60) * [ 2.75 * 16000/1.8 + 2 * 16000/1.8 * 6 ] = 273148 damage output, roughly.

Now remember there is a damage reduction in pvp. I belive like 50% reduction, so vs a player it would be about 136574.

This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "Darwec" (Apr 24th 2014, 5:29am)


7

Wednesday, April 23rd 2014, 7:14pm

im sure you thought this explained it in laymans terms it did not but that okay, its not all that important.

8

Wednesday, April 23rd 2014, 8:08pm

Perhaps you should ask about what is unclear in the formula. Darwec wrote out a considerable amount of abbreviations, and it should be quite easy to follow.

Cike

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9

Wednesday, April 23rd 2014, 8:24pm

darwec, is the 120% including the base 30% crit damage bonus? in the formula you stated, it is. if you have an extra 120% crit damage just on rings/food/etc alone,, then your crit modifier would be (1.3+1.2) = 2.5
my r/p can outdps r/m. your name is stupid.

mages should stack dex. word.

10

Thursday, April 24th 2014, 5:26am

darwec, is the 120% including the base 30% crit damage bonus? in the formula you stated, it is. if you have an extra 120% crit damage just on rings/food/etc alone,, then your crit modifier would be (1.3+1.2) = 2.5

i picked semi random numbers just to show math. I guess it is important to note that though.

Corrected to be 150%. Also is 150% *1.5 or *2.5? is 600% *7?

Quoted

im sure you thought this explained it in laymans terms it did not but that okay, its not all that important.

what was confusing? i tried to walk you through the logic and math. What do you need explained? Everything in the formula are things you can find in your character panel except crit damage and net attack speed.

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Darwec" (Apr 24th 2014, 5:36am)


11

Thursday, April 24th 2014, 5:37am

Quoted

Crit_mod = 1 + 0.3 (base) + X (any other crit mods u have: rings-skills-buffs)
from original posting. So 2 +16 rings + caviar is 1.3 + 1.1(approx) + .1 = 2.5 --> used in formulat you get "multiply by 2.5 when critting"

% dps skills are converted to decimals, no extra additions. 600% = 6.0 ---> "multiply by 6"

Tuulikki

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12

Thursday, April 24th 2014, 2:41pm

The reason so many attempts at resolving these equations come close but aren't 100%, be it melee dmg, magical dmg, healing, etc. is the formulas are most likely logarithmic based and not just simple algebra. It's quite common in gaming to use these type of equations in such things as experience from killing mobs.

For example: if(enemyLevel > playerLevel) exp = BASE_EXP * log(2, enemyLevel-playerLevel + 2); (Note: this is NOT the math for calculating the mob xp in RoM, it is just to illustrate a point).

As mentioned above, many players over the past years have tried to nail down the math and some have gotten "close" but the truth is the exact formula is known only to the devs. IMO, modeling the multitude of possibilities (log base 8 instead of 10 anyone? - that frustration comes from personal experience lol) promises to exceed the frustration level of all but the most hard core math enthusiasts.

Since blues are reported to actively be looking at forum posts now, perhaps we can ask that they send an e-mail to the devs and simply ask them for the formula so we aren't second guessing? Just a thought...
Titaia (100/100/55 M/P/K), Safia (100/100/75/60 K/P/W/S) - Badkitty
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Vanora (100/70/70 D/Wd/S), Morz (100/100/83 R/S/Wd) - Aurora

Quote: "Be yourself, everyone else is already taken" - Oscar Wilde

13

Sunday, April 27th 2014, 10:08am

just bringing out few examples concerning the dmg calculation, as of post 4

- critical dmg: the bonuses are additive on top of base non-crit. apparently, if u dont crit, then Crit_Mod=1. Lets assume a r/m with 70 elite, having 2x +16 rings, using caviar and pet passive. This results in critical dmg modifier equal to: 1 + 0.3 + 0.5 + 2*0.55 + 0.1 + 0.1 = 3.1

- on speed buffs: they apply multiplicatively in terms of (1-reduction): Assume a r/m with nimble hands (i put 10% speed for simplicity) and 70 elite using strong stimulant, lute, SA, FT and pet passive. Lets say that originally its weapon speed is 1.8 . The modified weapon speed is: 1.8 * 0.9 * 0.8 * 0.75 * 0.75 * 0.9 * 0.9 * 0.95 = 0.56

- Druffbaum's formulas apply 100% as is in game atm, even after few-years-patches have come after "discovered". Just keep in mind always to make tests on mobs of lvl equal or less than yours. best accuracy achieved at low lvl trash mobs where ADF=1

ps: if the formula does not produce the result u were expecting 1) check if the skill u use is AoE, 2) check if the skill u use has an additional attribute component (+0.3*DEX or *STR etc), 3) check ur math

Cike

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14

Tuesday, October 21st 2014, 11:45pm

prolly pointless to share this, but i was making this for myself to compare weapons.

yes, i know not everything is included, as i still need to fix some of the buff stuff, as well as aoe reduction, and the entire magic section needs to be created.

anywho, work in progress. it should be editable(at least the input portions, yellow/orange, by all).

as always, if there are any problems, including mathematical issues, or even suggestions on improvement, please tell me.

(mostly hoping fin or some1 else mathy will come by an double check it. it worked on all my tests, just want verification O.O )

oh, yeah, here it is:
damage calc spreadsheet
my r/p can outdps r/m. your name is stupid.

mages should stack dex. word.

heirienza

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15

Wednesday, October 22nd 2014, 2:55am

Cike, the damage formula for magic isn't taking into account skills that don't have an int modifier attached to them such as Psychic Arrows. If you put in 0 for the Int Modifier, it says that it does 0 damage.
Reni
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Téster - 95/61/60/45/45 CH/WL/R/P/M
Dontkillimascout - 90/61 WL/P

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16

Wednesday, October 22nd 2014, 2:59am

i did do a bit of adjusting, but i will check, thank you for the heads up.

honestly, i did the magic after it went live, so u may have tried it in the middle of tweaking xD
my r/p can outdps r/m. your name is stupid.

mages should stack dex. word.

heirienza

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17

Wednesday, October 22nd 2014, 3:06am

That would be quite possible. Because I just checked again, and It's working fine.
Reni
Mithras
Zerienga - 90/90 P/K
Téster - 95/61/60/45/45 CH/WL/R/P/M
Dontkillimascout - 90/61 WL/P

If you want to contact me quickly and efficiently, try the US IRC channel.
No, I don't know everything. I just use my knowledge to form educated guesses
And I listen when others say I am wrong in order to learn.

Cike

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18

Wednesday, October 22nd 2014, 3:08am

thanks, if you find anything else wrong, as always, poke me :P

if i have time, i may add aggro(in real values) as well
my r/p can outdps r/m. your name is stupid.

mages should stack dex. word.

This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "Cike" (Oct 22nd 2014, 3:14am)


heirienza

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19

Wednesday, October 22nd 2014, 3:14am

Will do. Currently gonna test if your formula holds true for warlocks. Cause Puzzlement doesn't do what one would expect it would do compared to Psychic Arrows....
Reni
Mithras
Zerienga - 90/90 P/K
Téster - 95/61/60/45/45 CH/WL/R/P/M
Dontkillimascout - 90/61 WL/P

If you want to contact me quickly and efficiently, try the US IRC channel.
No, I don't know everything. I just use my knowledge to form educated guesses
And I listen when others say I am wrong in order to learn.

Cike

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20

Wednesday, October 22nd 2014, 3:16am

yes, there are funny things. this is the most current magical damage formula i could find, so i'm not super sure how valid it still is. it was taken from midknight's post discussing revamping the magical formula, and he had it as reference.

if there are more current versions of the formulas, i will be glad to update it.

also, so we don't clog this thread up, if there is an issue, leave a comment on the instructions page(you should be allowed to), and i will try and fix it as soon as possible. that way, other people will know that there is an issue with it as well, so they do not get wrong values.
my r/p can outdps r/m. your name is stupid.

mages should stack dex. word.