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mnkmurphy885

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1

Thursday, November 17th 2011, 12:43pm

How do you feel about your mage's performance?

Ok, so. We've been balanced for a while now and many of us have regeared and restatted in Chapter 4. How do you feel about how your mage performs as a dps class in instances and pvp as compared to the many melee classes we play with and go up against in siege war?

Also, do you feel like mages have a "gear gap", and by that I mean, do you feel that your mage is more difficult to gear in general than your melee friends, and that you have to outgear melee to achieve similar dps output?

I ask this because when I check my scrut, I am still having the pants beat off me by equivalently geared melee toons in gch and sardo. My mage does decent damage (enough that I rate an invite) but it seems like me and my mage colleagues have to tier higher and stat more mattack than our melee friends to achieve dps that's even close.

Also, it seems like RoM is still conspiring against us by making it hard for us to obtain the gear and stats we need. Perhaps we're just unlucky, but it seems like mage drops are the rarest of all in both sardo and grafu. Are we the only ones experiencing this?

I'm immensely grateful that RW fixed us, because we (and every other dps class besides scout) were profoundly broken in chap3, but I still feel some lingering mage rage. I don't mean to whine, and I guess I'd just like to hear from others to see if my experience is a preview of what being fully geared is like or if mage performs better once melee and magic are both fully geared in GCH/Sardo gear.

Also, how do you think your mage will be performing once the level cap is increased to 70? Better or worse?

Thoughts?

(and if you would, please state your gear/instance level and subclass/es in the responses? Just so we can get an idea of where your perspective is coming from)

I am M/P/S currently doing GCH (up to fourth boss, hope to say 6th boss tomorrow ;)), and I still have a t10 Raksha +16, half bunker/crimson, half temple/tomb, about 50k mattack, 55k hp unbuffed.
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
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Paz on mages: i have full and complete faith blizzard will keep us fail and balanced.

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Thursday, November 17th 2011, 1:01pm

Being a newbie, I really shouldn't say anything about a class, to tell you the truth. However, I like the idea of the Mage. Their powerful attacks eliminate enemies quickly and powerfuly.

Also, as a side note, I'm having different thoughts about my main character. He's a M/P, but I'm wondering if I should use Rogue for now. It seems more fun, and the Priests attack are rather weak, but thhe healing is good to have on hand.
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Thursday, November 17th 2011, 1:43pm

Same as Spinechiller11, I'm newbie mage/knight originally, but I did switch to mage/rogue since it's much more fun class combo to play. (you have to love cursed fangs and kiss of the vampire elites :))

Mage is rare class that 2 main attack both have either cast time (flame) or CD (fireball), but I believe that 2 good AOE are adding well to mage's survivability. (was able to survive ganging of all earth elementals in GG last night thanks to PF and friend with quick reflexes.)

4

Thursday, November 17th 2011, 8:50pm

I'm a 67 Mage / 67 Priest (mostly) and geared with Ch 3 item sets which have mostly tomb stats, but have upgraded to a few bunker/crimson/castle stats on rings, cape, and wings.

I use a T10 Puppet Queen Staff (8k damage), and have around 50 Matt, and 60K hp unbuffed, but my pet pushes all those up and fully buffed I hit around 65kMatt and 105k hp.

I don't do a lot of instance runs, so hard to comment on that. I do well in Siege...mostly, it is the P/S that insta-kill me and Rogues equally geared to myself (or at least with good weapons) take me down pretty easy.

All that being said, I'm happy with the changes to Mage, and my class. I've been a M/P since Ch 1, and have little interest in other classes, or class combos. I picked up Knight for when I want to be a Priest...but looking at the M/K combo is interesting...if I ever get enough TP to max out the M/K elites I might switch to that...not sure yet.

In summary...I enjoy my class of Mage.
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5

Friday, November 18th 2011, 12:44am

One thing I was never able to understand is why m/p's always had trouble with dps and they could never figure out why...

Have you ever compared a r/s's dps to a r/p? or a w/r's dps to a w/p?

When you gain survivability/heals on a char instead of picking a dps secondary...guess what happens?

not saying m/p is bad dps, it can do the job just fine... I just feel as if mages stat too much for survivability instead of the heavy hitting glass cannons they're supposed to be.

let's say you have a m/w or m/r or m/wd ( those are my 3 favourite mage combos in no particular order) and they would stat int/ma crimson bunker castle tomb with a couple stam/ma or int/stam crim/bunk to finish the job....what do you think the result would be? let's just pick m/w because they have the zerk perk affecting their MA....you would have some insane number like 150k mattack(just a random number, im sure im not far off.)+ guitar+ancient spirit water so you have ridiculously fast flames.

Rogues and warriors need the extra hp boost because of the proximity they have during these fights, however mages and scouts should rethink all the stamina/hp stats they use imo.... maybe im alone in this but ive been telling mages on my server since ch1 that they will be much happier as super OP glass cannons...I mean...they get 1 shot ANYWAY :rolleyes::D


anyway sorry to get away from the original point in question...I feel as if mages have it easy when it comes to statting...it seems they have sweet guaranteed pulls compared to melee classes since temple pulls...( trust me...the first 7 bunker pulls as a rogue this chapter trying to get a dex/pa gave me 5 dex/mdef and 2 pa/pdef :mad:)



-sas

6

Friday, November 18th 2011, 1:23am

Quoted from "kagemushaa;484156"

...I feel as if mages have it easy when it comes to statting...it seems they have sweet guaranteed pulls compared to melee classes since temple pulls...
-sas


While I agree that we have a nice Stam/Matk guaranteed pull I dont see how having only 2 viable crimsons(int/ma, int/stam), 3 viable bunkers (int/ma, int/sta, sta/matk), and then one or two of the castles makes it "easier" for us.

I see many physical dps classes able comfortably use 3-4 Crimson stats to great effect. but perhaps I'm missing something

7

Friday, November 18th 2011, 2:24am

Now im a mage/knight (11.5k int, 45k mattack, 50k hp) and from what ive seen is that mages are not able to keep up with other classes in dps. We are able to somewhat stay up there with the other classes in dps when we use elemental catalysis and spellcasting decreasing items to get our flame cast as low as possible but as soon as those 20 seconds are up we cant compete with other classes in dps. I would think that decreasing the time of flame would greatly help in mages dps or increasing the damage it does since in 3 seconds other classes can get alot of skills off and do more damage than 1 flame does. Also the cooldown on Elemental catalysis needs to be lowered, id say around 3 mins would be fine, because my party has had to wait on me for my buffs to be up. And without elemental catalysis my dps will not be of much help.

8

Friday, November 18th 2011, 3:38am

Quoted from "lalo1099;484173"

Now im a mage/knight (11.5k int, 45k mattack, 50k hp) and from what ive seen is that mages are not able to keep up with other classes in dps. We are able to somewhat stay up there with the other classes in dps when we use elemental catalysis and spellcasting decreasing items to get our flame cast as low as possible but as soon as those 20 seconds are up we cant compete with other classes in dps. I would think that decreasing the time of flame would greatly help in mages dps or increasing the damage it does since in 3 seconds other classes can get alot of skills off and do more damage than 1 flame does. Also the cooldown on Elemental catalysis needs to be lowered, id say around 3 mins would be fine, because my party has had to wait on me for my buffs to be up. And without elemental catalysis my dps will not be of much help.


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Domenico 70 Mage / 70 Priest (/ 67 Knight)

9

Friday, November 18th 2011, 9:39pm

It's the fact that mages can get guaranteed stats for their mems cuts down on how many mems they waste trying to obtain their stats....seems to me they also have a ma/hp pull? I could be wrong, but I thought I remembered seeing 2 good bunker stats for mages that were 100% pulls?
no 100% castle stats available? ( I dont pull castle so I cant remember what they offer for 100% pulls)

either way... my point being that as a rogue..even if I have more stat options available to me...it's taxing farming mems and pulling all the stats by pure chance...even one or two options to have viable stats readily available like mages(healers and knight also have nice stats like hp/pdef that are 100%) do would cut down on my statting time by quite a bit.


as for the dps issue...(overlooking that I still think a mage should have a dps secondary to compete against a double dps class melee player.) in chapter 2 mages dominated everything....pvp and pve, they were the original one shot kings and were godly in the ch2 dungeons and raids.

ch3 focused on scouts and ch4 seems to be giving love to rogues, warriors and wardens, seems like everyone gets their day in the sun in rom...mages just have to wait their turn again...and by the looks of things it might be sooner than you think . :D

-sas

mnkmurphy885

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Saturday, November 19th 2011, 6:39am

Quoted from "kagemushaa;484317"

It's the fact that mages can get guaranteed stats for their mems cuts down on how many mems they waste trying to obtain their stats....seems to me they also have a ma/hp pull? I could be wrong, but I thought I remembered seeing 2 good bunker stats for mages that were 100% pulls?
no 100% castle stats available? ( I dont pull castle so I cant remember what they offer for 100% pulls)

either way... my point being that as a rogue..even if I have more stat options available to me...it's taxing farming mems and pulling all the stats by pure chance...even one or two options to have viable stats readily available like mages(healers and knight also have nice stats like hp/pdef that are 100%) do would cut down on my statting time by quite a bit.


as for the dps issue...(overlooking that I still think a mage should have a dps secondary to compete against a double dps class melee player.) in chapter 2 mages dominated everything....pvp and pve, they were the original one shot kings and were godly in the ch2 dungeons and raids.

ch3 focused on scouts and ch4 seems to be giving love to rogues, warriors and wardens, seems like everyone gets their day in the sun in rom...mages just have to wait their turn again...and by the looks of things it might be sooner than you think . :D

-sas


I don't disagree that we have 2 decent guaranteed mem pulls, but we still only have 2 usable crimsons and that hurts a lot. But my biggest beef is that mage gear seems to drop so infrequently in the actual instances. Now, like I said, it might just be me and the parties I run in having bad luck. I wondered if others might have noticed a trend also.

And I am a 2 dps class toon, I use my m/s in instances most frequently. I only use m/p in GCH sometimes, as I am the lowest dps mage in party and the Essence of Magic buff helps us all out. Since my buff helps the other mages hit harder it's a net plus.

We get the occasional mage stat to drop in grafu normal, just haven't seen a single piece of Chappy gear drop in all the runs we've ever done o.O
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
World First solo Amboriar
Paz on mages: i have full and complete faith blizzard will keep us fail and balanced.

11

Saturday, November 19th 2011, 3:57pm

I'm a M/D/W and for runs I usually go M/W and I do fine for the 20 seconds that my buffs are up. With all my consumables and my elemental catalysis I actually beat most if not all the melee DPS but without my 5 I'm kind of useless. My stats are 14.8K Int/58K matk/ 55K HP unbuffed if you need a comparison.

mnkmurphy885

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Saturday, November 19th 2011, 11:48pm

Quoted from "ConcernedMage;484426"

I'm a M/D/W and for runs I usually go M/W and I do fine for the 20 seconds that my buffs are up. With all my consumables and my elemental catalysis I actually beat most if not all the melee DPS but without my 5 I'm kind of useless. My stats are 14.8K Int/58K matk/ 55K HP unbuffed if you need a comparison.


You using a t10 +16 Puppet Queen CM?
I can only fantasize about that, we're semi-stuck on the zombies at the moment lol.

I am starting to think that my problems are mostly in my head, as it occurred to me that my melee friends are mostly using the Bow of Assembled Parts, whereas the mages are all still using Rakshas cause we haven't killed last boss sardo yet (we can kill him I think, we got the hallway of deathballs beat, we just picked weirdo times to try it like seconds before the server reset ugh, and anyway we've refocused on GCH) so none of us has a Cast-Out staff to compare apples to apples.

The rogues mostly have Tia's too.

Hmmm, we gotta gotta get Puppet Queens. And I need more mattack.
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
World First solo Amboriar
Paz on mages: i have full and complete faith blizzard will keep us fail and balanced.

13

Sunday, November 20th 2011, 3:20pm

it takes a while for mages to come to full "bloom" i guess. but in the end (of this chapter anyways until tuesday) you can be top dps in a hard mode raid. just takes some luck on crit/outburst. i never saw it until i was almost fully re-statted/geared and again, had crazy luck on crits.

but we see mages usually second or third on the dps/epeen meter in some fights...boss 5,6 and always 3rd in grafu hm.

m/w m/s seem to have an easier time getting there..but m/k with their crit dmg boost on all the time and m/p with eruption...m/d with the huge mattack boost etc. all the combos can get there in the end i think.

14

Sunday, November 20th 2011, 4:49pm

Quoted from "mnkmurphy885;484520"

You using a t10 +16 Puppet Queen CM?
I can only fantasize about that, we're semi-stuck on the zombies at the moment lol.

Hmmm, we gotta gotta get Puppet Queens. And I need more mattack.


Yes I'm using a T10+16 puppet queen which gives me 8K Mdam and with buffs it goes to 10K Mdam which helps a lot in dealing damage.

As far as mattack goes as long as you reach the 70-80K limit you should be doing fine in SC/GC if you're not reaching that limit then you might want to work on that. Other than that you want to get your crit rate and critical magical damage as high as possible. (My crit rate is at 67% and critical magic damage is at 115% with moti blended susages + pet + 2 rings)

mnkmurphy885

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Sunday, November 20th 2011, 10:31pm

I'm getting there CM, slowly but surely. I buff to over 80k mattak, but that means sacrificing damage foods/pots. I'm stuck in a gear bottleneck at the moment, not sure if I should wait for an OD assembled parts belt, just use a Kawak's belt to make up the crit or just suck it up and keep using my temple/tombed raksha side pieces. I can't afford to stat underdura anymore, I die too much and all my dias are going to hammers.

On that note, anyone have a preference as far as side pieces go? The lack of crit on the assembled parts set is discouraging. I haven't seen the new set from the 70 instance, hope it's more appealing.

And that's really encouraging Paz, thank you for that. Mage sucked so very badly in chap3 that I think it left some of us with a complex- I am afraid to look at the scrut now in GCH and even Sardo. Now I have some hope :)

You guys have soothed a lot of my worries.
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
World First solo Amboriar
Paz on mages: i have full and complete faith blizzard will keep us fail and balanced.

16

Sunday, November 20th 2011, 10:53pm

Quoted

Mage sucked so very badly in chap3


<shiver> the dark times.....ugh

yea from tanks beating us half the time in dps AND total dmg, now sometimes bursting over 700-800k+ dps in hard mode. quite a change.

sets i think is chapeu...jugs (unless aoth possible) and raksha or assembled pieces. as you gain mattack try swapping to mattack food in grafu and see how it goes. sardo is a bit higher mdef...but you may get some better results. have to play around a bit.

crit..seems like 65-67 is fine. everything over just averages out to not much gain, diminishing returns. i think im at 80.2 in burn (5775 whatever that is) and on avg i dont crit more than other mages with significantly less.

17

Sunday, November 20th 2011, 11:23pm

Among DPS classes, geared roughly the same, I see Mages about in the middle of dps, perhaps a little higher than middle, but not quite on top. But every 5 minutes, a Mage will top the chart by a LOT, doing easily double the dps of the second highest. That kind of self buff is incrediblly OP. I wish I could spam my 3s cast at < 1s cast times every 5 minutes.
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18

Monday, November 21st 2011, 12:02am

yea half second flames + 650 crit pot icing on top..combined with a few outburst crits give silly dps numbers. and have a dead mage growing mold on the carpet if they didnt tranq/unharmed half the time. :D doesnt happen often (often enough) but its schweet when it does.

oddly enough, s/wd seems usual top by a good margin in our nightly runs...i think druff called that quite a while ago? i can rarely if ever keep up with the two that run with us a lot. hell even once i had a sigil and i still got smoked. :/

but really is nice with such a big improvement over mages in ch3 rt-diamond. ugh^2