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MegaMouseSEC

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1

Friday, February 3rd 2012, 11:23pm

This is for RoMage

Ok here you go Romage as I promiced this is a lnk to imageshack where i stuck my stats for you to check out:


Uploaded with ImageShack.us

I still have one piece of gear to get ahold of so I am not quite done with my build yet.

YomanROM

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Friday, February 3rd 2012, 11:36pm

Now please tell us how what we see on the screen fits to:

Quoted from "MegaMouseSEC;506146"


Yall should really look at Dexterity a bit closer.
Most players ignore it but I have found that it seriously increases my dodge rate, which helps when a boss decides to like me better than the tank (which even with 2 recon 5 runes still happens too often).
Having stacked Dex I can dodge 50-75% of most bosses attacks easily, which gives the tank plenty of time to get his/her attention back.
With a high dodge rate comes the added benefit of not actually haveing to stack stamina so much, because the mobs and bosses cannot hit you.
[....]
In most fights due to my propensity to steal aggro I cannot go all out. But when I am asked to go all out (for especially tough fights) I have learned to slow down when my aggro meter is getting too close for comfort.

As far as the instances I hit with friends TOSH hard with tehm as often as they can allow me too (they have mages within their guild that like to hit TOSH so I am more of a backup when they have not got one online).
[...]


this.

NOW im curious.

lol

MegaMouseSEC

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3

Saturday, February 4th 2012, 1:38am

Lets try this again. Most mages ignore the benefits of Dexterity if I am not mistaken. They would rather go for Matk and/or intel. Both Matk and intel are nice but what happens when you steal aggro from your tank? Most of the times you end up eating dirt.
Now looking at Dexterity what does it give a mage that could help out? It increases your Dodge rate. The better your dodge rate the more often that a mob will miss hitting you thus saving your hide. Some of you will say just to use a recon rune, well I have 2 inserted in my weapons (having scout as my secondary class I can equip a bow which gives me more stat slots).
This is my reason for statting Dexterity: unless a tank is perfect at holding aggro, most times I can and will steal it from him even if I am not going full burn. Having statted the ammount of dexterity I have increases my survival rate by giving me a better chance to dodge most if not all the bosses attacks until the tank can get the boss/mobs aggro attention again. Without my higher than normal dodge rate I would most likely be eating dirt well before the tank can regain the boss's attention. At full burn I can and have stolen aggro rather quickly (an ex guildy and I did an experiment with the bosses in DoD to see just how fast I could steal aggro) from some really well geared tanks.
Although I am not perfectly statted like some players think they are, I find the way I ahve mine set to work to my advantage (especialy since I like to solo any instance that I can). It boils down to this: Would you rather have zero chance at surviving a boss going after you, or would you rather have a 1% chance at surviving that same boss. Personaly I want that 1% even if it gives the tank enough time to regain aggro.

4

Saturday, February 4th 2012, 2:08am

Mouse... Dex helps your dodge rate. But your posted amount of Dex, 2912, would not help you dodge in ToSH at all. Sure you may dodge quite a bit in Dod-KT. Dodge is based on your level vs the mob's level. Lets pretend Dodge showed a % like parry or crit does. Pretend your Dodge % read 25%. That means you can dodge monster's your level 25% of the time. If the monster is lower level than you, the % of dodging is higher. If the level of the monster is higher than you, the % of dodging is lower. 2912 Dex is probably 10% dodge. Maybe less. I have 4150 Dex and I dodge a lot in RT, however when I'm tanking ToSH- H, I dodge maybe 5% of the time.

And as for your aggro problem... Buy a better Recon rune. Recon VII's are cheap on the AH, they go for about 5m per. At those prices, why don't you have it? 2 Recon VII's + Unharmed set skill = -90% aggro. If your tank cannot hold -90% aggro then he does not deserve to tank. Unharmed Mage is from WA in case you don't know where it comes from. Properly rune yourself and you will never have to worry about stealing aggro, then, you will not have a need to stat Dex. As many have said, Dexterity on a Mage is useless. Do not use it.
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mnkmurphy885

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Saturday, February 4th 2012, 2:40am

Quoted from "MegaMouseSEC;507549"

Lets try this again. Most mages ignore the benefits of Dexterity if I am not mistaken. They would rather go for Matk and/or intel. Both Matk and intel are nice but what happens when you steal aggro from your tank? Most of the times you end up eating dirt.
Now looking at Dexterity what does it give a mage that could help out? It increases your Dodge rate. The better your dodge rate the more often that a mob will miss hitting you thus saving your hide. Some of you will say just to use a recon rune, well I have 2 inserted in my weapons (having scout as my secondary class I can equip a bow which gives me more stat slots).
This is my reason for statting Dexterity: unless a tank is perfect at holding aggro, most times I can and will steal it from him even if I am not going full burn. Having statted the ammount of dexterity I have increases my survival rate by giving me a better chance to dodge most if not all the bosses attacks until the tank can get the boss/mobs aggro attention again. Without my higher than normal dodge rate I would most likely be eating dirt well before the tank can regain the boss's attention. At full burn I can and have stolen aggro rather quickly (an ex guildy and I did an experiment with the bosses in DoD to see just how fast I could steal aggro) from some really well geared tanks.
Although I am not perfectly statted like some players think they are, I find the way I ahve mine set to work to my advantage (especialy since I like to solo any instance that I can). It boils down to this: Would you rather have zero chance at surviving a boss going after you, or would you rather have a 1% chance at surviving that same boss. Personaly I want that 1% even if it gives the tank enough time to regain aggro.


I kind of want to start playing the mage I rolled on Reni just so I can trade you Int/Dex stats for the Int/Ma ones you seem to be throwing away Mega- I can't think of a statting choice that would explain the high Int and insanely low Ma numbers you're showing there.... Are you really not statting Ma at all???

And the dodging thing with Dex that low... the mind, it boggles. Like Bangs said, A) if you are taking too much aggro from a competent tank, use real Recons and Unharmed. B) if you are still taking aggro, get a real tank. Dodge is not going to help you do content close to your level. Unless you are a rogue and can stack metric craptons of it. Bangs would know, as he is a tank and has more than double your Dex.

Quoted

Although I am not perfectly statted like some players think they are, I find the way I ahve mine set to work to my advantage (especialy since I like to solo any instance that I can). It boils down to this: Would you rather have zero chance at surviving a boss going after you, or would you rather have a 1% chance at surviving that same boss. Personaly I want that 1% even if it gives the tank enough time to regain aggro.


Dude. "Perfectly statted" is the way the vast vast vast majority of more experienced actual endgame players think is reasonable. If you want to stat Dex- have fun with that. Just don't expect not to take flack for it, because it's not the best way for your average mage to stat; ie. to do damage. If you want to stat to be able to solo RT some day- well, it's probably not ideal for that even. I have a mage in guild who did solo RT full on normal and bronze (on m/p), and he has little dex, and a crapton of stam and Ma. He also knows when to use immune skills and candies, and Phirius D-pots, and those are also quite handy, more handy than maybe dodging. The mage shield skill popped at the right time combined with a D-pot will do you more good than double the Dex you have.

Learn to play, learn to stat. You'll save money, time and ridicule by doing so.
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
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Saturday, February 4th 2012, 3:02am

Quoted from "mnkmurphy885;507559"

I have a mage in guild who did solo RT full on normal and bronze (on m/p), and he has little dex, and a crapton of stam and Ma.


Even the tree?

7

Saturday, February 4th 2012, 8:23am

Ok mega, with those numbers, there's NO way you're dodging tosh bosses at the rate you claimed you were. Upgrade your ch2 recon V to an up to date(ish) Recon VII. NO mage needs dex, not even a m/s. Your matk is ridiculously low, so any claim you make about beating out any true end game mages is just laughable. Also considering your mdmg is just as low only cements my beliefs.

Oh, btw, tosh easy doesn't count towards any credibility you're trying to establish. The 1st boss is 4 man-able (only because of torches) and the rest is duo-able and possibly soloable.

If the tank loses aggro to you, its *not* because you dps well, its because you have a cheap recon V that even I replaced at lvl 55. There's NO point in hiding your name btw, I already called you out during your little "end gamer" rant in world shout. Lucky for you, Elvie held me back from saying anything further.

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mnkmurphy885

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Saturday, February 4th 2012, 9:05am

Quoted from "CharlieBananas;507561"

Even the tree?


Yah, I'm not positive he's gotten Naylodas down on Bronze yet, but I am positive he got him on norm, and Bronze isn't that much worse. Tree's a fast-burn pushover, and with a Mana Source, a Magic Fruit Pie, and Recover Magic to take care of the mana suckers, and a candy, m/p immune, mage-shield + D-pot to mitigate damage- its doable.

I wouldn't want to try it myself, but I'm not a solo-freak either.
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
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mnkmurphy885

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Saturday, February 4th 2012, 12:40pm

Ok Mega. Let's recap.

Bangs splained why the amount of Dex you have is too little to save you from much of anything in ToSH.

Raves splained that Elvie yelled at him so he'd stop lolling at you in Reni WC (WTB someone letting me know so I can get on my Reni toon next time Elvie has to go AFK and Raves buys megas. Also WTB popcorn).

Anyone else think we're due for a new post on meanie endgamers in 3, 2, 1...

Look. Mega. We're all feeling some schadenfreude. Ok, a lot of schadenfreude. But... no one is being mean to you just to be mean. We want you to listen, and learn, and get better. Stop wasting money and time, and start becoming the badass endgamer that you want to be. Unlike on my server (aka Podunksville) most of the things you need are readily available in the AH. Regear, restat, restart and you can actually be that endgamer. Farm some dogmeat, maybe even sell some dias if you have to- you'll be good to go in no time at all. I would literally kill to have access to Reni's AH.

Looking down your nose at us and calling us selfish elitists is just a way to make yourself feel superior. I'm not superior- you should see my crappy gears. I'm still working on it, all the time. One piece at a time, as "perfectly statted" as it can be.

I have to actually go farm all my gears, and that's a major pain in the bum. All you need to do to be a better mage is admit that there are things you still need to learn and ask for some advice, and there are a lot of knowledgeable people (like Yoman, whom I bug daily) that would be happy to take the time to do so. Farm some gold, spend some dias, and you'll start making posts about how endgame isn't all it's cracked up to be just like we do. ;)
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
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YomanROM

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Saturday, February 4th 2012, 4:05pm

since even diamond has been done mage-duo ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EBheYDcjnc ) , i dont see a reason why bronze solo should not be possible for a lvl70 endgame mage?

---
@MegaMouseSec:
as for DEX i think i made my point in the other thread, but again and explicit:

DODGE works in PvE only against NORMAL attacks (WHITEHITS).
Any Skill that has a name can not be dodged. (This will happen in DoD B1 still, if youre 13 Level above the boss... its just the boss missing you instead of you doding the hit with the same result = zero damage from that hit. but it has nothing to do with your dex)

2912 DEX is NOTHING. thats 2265 dodge. You wont dodge anything with that from a mob or even a boss that has a higher level than the player. period. ESPECIALLY NOT IN TOMB OF SEVEN HEROES.

You wont take aggro of anyone equally geared with what we see on the screenshot, unless the tank doesnt know his job. Better Recon runes always help though, and if they are really 5M (wtf) for Tier7 in your AH you may get TWO as fast as you can (Mage/Scout).

For the part of keeping it civil:

Just do 3x Int/matk 3x Int/Sta and get rid of Dex. Use Potential Runes, thats +all attributes (that includes Dex!!!)... thats enough Dex a Mage ever needs. And please stop talking like you anything about game mechanics when you dont, thanks.

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Saturday, February 4th 2012, 11:03pm

ive been working on yawaka in rt-diamond, and if i could dodge like ONCE he be deaded. best ive gotten him to is 392k hp left and that required a phoenix redemption. one.more.flame.....gah!

<3 stupid solo attempts :D

YomanROM

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Saturday, February 4th 2012, 11:06pm

stat some 5k dex, it helps! /sarcasm

try rogue/priest alt and maybe get a Aoth Blade Cape ;)

14

Saturday, February 4th 2012, 11:25pm

lol blade cape was my 1st thought...but i dont think we've seen even one yet. imagine that, a mage cape before the rogue one.

i wonder how much being in swap gear increases dodge? :D

15

Sunday, February 5th 2012, 2:52am

This thread is full of win...

There's no way Mega is even doing ToSh hard, let alone dodging in it or taking aggro with those stats.
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mnkmurphy885

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Sunday, February 5th 2012, 8:49am

Oh I disagree Borella, I bet he can pull aggro. He has two Recon 5's. If he's in a party where everyone and their cousin is using Recon IX's or even Recon VII's, he could pull, especially if the tank is undergeared/unable to generate sufficient threat.

If he isn't using the scrutinizer and instead is using a threatmeter to judge his dps output relative to others in a theoretical group, he could be thinking that his dps is actually way higher than it is. Scrutinizer hasn't been on Curse for a while, though I think it is on Curseforge, and there's a new one available that's been updated to include Warden pets that you can get off the Euro forums. The scrutinizer is the only accurate way to judge your dps, and is pretty much a must-have for all dps classes.

Xbar has a dpsmeter functionality, but it sucks so hard it doesn't bear thinking of.

This could all be just an honest mistake caused by the lack of a good addon.

I'd be fascinated to see what buffs Mega is using also. His mention of "going all out" make me wonder what going all out is. I wonder if any of the mage buff guides still exist, or if they all got deleted like the other class guides.

At any rate Mega, if you don't have Scrutinizer, look for it on Curseforge.com, unless you have a wd/s, and then search out that shiny new one on the Euro forums. And it is definitely time to upgrade to better Recon runes. VII is about as low as you should go.
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
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Paz on mages: i have full and complete faith blizzard will keep us fail and balanced.

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Sunday, February 5th 2012, 10:16am

If you are stealing agrro from the tank then one of the following is true:

Your tank sucks.
Your tank is way less geared then you ( why would a less geared person keep agrro anyways)
You are cheap because using fail recs like V or something like that.

18

Tuesday, February 7th 2012, 10:15am

bottom line: dex on a mage = terrible idea and waste of stat space.

19

Tuesday, February 7th 2012, 10:57pm

Quoted from "bobinator501;508200"

bottom line: dex on a mage = terrible idea and waste of stat space.


+1. That's really all there is to say on the subject.
Borella - 100 W/M/S/R/P/K
VVV
If you play P/K in instances you're garbage


20

Tuesday, February 7th 2012, 11:14pm

Well, now that we have a consensus on dex, how about statting a lot of strength on a mage. I mean, it does give an hp boost, right? Everyone likes hp and being strong
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