Runes of Magic US / AU

Quoted from "quentinludwigs;524508"

This subject was discussed in another thread but I thought I would revisit it. I'm a wd/w on grimdal. Recently I switched from a T10 +16 Hero's giant bladed axe, to using a 1-h sword and a talisman. In the previous thread, this idea was ruled out because of the 50% 2-H damage modifier. Well now I use a clean tiered t8 sword of protection (hatred x, wrath viii, raid vii, curse vii) and a green quest talisman with another hatred x. I'll put more runes in it soon. I just wanted to test the results. Instance buffed (15 min buffs) I sit at 328k Hp and 490k+ pdef. I must say...I was scared to switch to 1-h for aggro reasons...now with 2 hatred x runes I hold aggro much much easier! This is a pretty big discovery for me. Hopefully it's info more wardens can use. Maybe my build is a bit odd but it works. I hold aggro on trash mobs and bosses in gch and tosh without any issue at all now.

I don't doubt you can tank with 1h + talisman, but I don't understand how you can hold aggro more easily. At most it should be about the same, depending on how you stat the talisman ( I don't consider the stats on 1h cause you can equally clean stat a 2h).
Assuming you have 25k patt unbuffed, and the offhand is statted offensively you can gain about 3k patt. (12-13%). You also gain an extra hatred so you get an additional +54% aggro.
However, you lose 50% damage from weapon mastery, plus the inherent lower damage of 2h weapons. Here depending on the details, one setup can generate more aggro than the other, but I can't find in my mind anything that could explain a big difference.

Btw... Can raid runes also be put in talisman? ( wrath and fatal only affect the weapon they are embedded in right?)

Not criticising... Only trying to understand. You are after all the best/second best geared wd/w I've heard of. :-)

Blasphemy.

I'm pretty sure dmg helped with aggro, but wasn't that significant. Mainly because I've used a crappy weapon without a hatred at one time and I still held aggro , though had to work a little. I pretty sure extra hatred X is helping out significantly more than the dmg was. Simple test would be to remove it and see what happens.

Just wondering, did you just use an OD white talisman? I'm likely going to test this a little when I can get another Hatred X.

But if it does work, I'd try for a nice talisman with a significant amount of Mdef just cause. Makes it nice also cause I could now have a 2-h without hatred for dps ad w/wd or just leveling wd/w, and use the 1-h/talisman with hatreds for tanking.

I now just have to con a knight and borrow their sword for a short period.

It's an unfair comparison, since the Axe you had before has only ~8.6% more dps than the sword, while Lekani's Strength has like 17% more dps than Letin's Protection

Anyway, for endgame setup with ~850 dmg from gear + food:

Lekani's Strength T11+16 (with Mastery of 50%): 5810 DPS, 7320 p.att
Letin's Protection T11+16: 3470 DPS, 3660 p.att

-> 67,4% more DPS

2 Hatred X vs. 1 Hatred X: 2,08/1,54 = 35% more Aggro

-> 24% more Aggro with 2H so far

To compensate this at (let's say) 30k p.att with Hero and fix boni, you would need to get 7.8k more p.att with Talisman than with 2H -> you need to get 11.5k p.att from stats and runes

-> impossible to compensate

-> 1H + Talisman is no real option for a Wd/W if you think about it

If you don't have aggro issues even with 1H, you can stick to it ofc, but it is only worth to do so, if you already don't use p.att stats on your items at all and still can hold Aggro (which I doubt....but on US servers it might be different cause of the high Recon runes available there)

I just see at myself that with 43k p.att instance buffed (with p.att food, without wine ofc) and T11 Lekani's Strength with Raid VIII the aggro is enough, but I wouldn't want to lose more actually, since it can get very close sometimes (especially on Trash in ToSH hard)

50% dmg increase equals to 50% increase of the Aggro you got without it. Aggro increase like from Hatred rune however works different, since all the boni are calced together and added on base Aggro.

So when you got already 1 Hatred X and no other +Aggro, you got 154% of base Aggro. With another Hatred X you get 208% of base Aggro -> 208/154 = 1,35 -> 35% more Aggro

-> the more +Aggro you got already, the less effective is even more +Aggro, while on damage it stacks up.

two handed= one hatred X 56% aggro 1 handed and a talisman two hatred x's now 112% more aggro makes perfect sense why it would work, double the aggro and not even based off damage, dont forget people people warden/warrior have many skills that produce aggro, and increase it too. forget pattack damage everything another hatred x is sick nasty

Quoted from "FarmerTom;524688"

two handed= one hatred X 56% aggro 1 handed and a talisman two hatred x's now 112% more aggro makes perfect sense why it would work, double the aggro and not even based off damage, dont forget people people warden/warrior have many skills that produce aggro, and increase it too. forget pattack damage everything another hatred x is sick nasty

1. Hatred x is 54% when OD.
2. Did you read druffbaum's explanation at all?

Quoted from "FarmerTom;524688"

two handed= one hatred X 56% aggro 1 handed and a talisman two hatred x's now 112% more aggro makes perfect sense why it would work, double the aggro and not even based off damage, dont forget people people warden/warrior have many skills that produce aggro, and increase it too. forget pattack damage everything another hatred x is sick nasty

You got no idea, read my post on page 1 again

That's cool, would be better if they had some talismans for melee characters. I'm sure it works but is there a benefit to doing so?
Is it true that Hatred/Reconciliation actually work in offhand items like shields and talismans?
Also, has anyone tested if 1h Weapons generate more aggro like how Wands generate more healing power? I feel like it could be there but undiscovered.

After all the number crunching and such, it really comes down to what works best for the player and their guild. If you can sacrifice some aggro generation for HP/STAM/pdef and its not causing issues during runs then by all means it works for you. Thats the problem with math, is it restricting and nu-imaginative. Bravo on trying something different.