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1

Friday, June 1st 2012, 4:47am

Why does flame do more damage than fireball?

I cannot figure out the math behind why this is...

On my mage/druid my flame does far more damage than fireball (both at the same level) even though the fireball spell shows it should be doing more damage than flame. The only time fireball does more damage is when I have no staff equiped, however as soon as I equip my staff the flame now does far more damage. It is very consistant and repeatable. The staffs don't have any special abilities. Is this a glitch or is this intended? Its driving me crazy :confused:

2

Friday, June 1st 2012, 4:50am

Flame has a three second cast time. Cast times multiply the damage and make it more damage. That's why flame hits harder than Fireball.
Borella - 100 W/M/S/R/P/K
VVV
If you play P/K in instances you're garbage


3

Friday, June 1st 2012, 5:07am

Ahhhh now its starting to make sense :p Thanks for the quick response

mnkmurphy885

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4

Friday, June 1st 2012, 2:12pm

Wow Bor. That's, like, concise and stuff. Here's the Fannified version:

Every second of cast time on any spell gives it a damage multiplier, Wake. So, like, Flame has a cast time of three seconds- that gives it a cast time multiplier of three. Fireball is an instant cast, so it has no cast time multiplier. A priest's Rising Tide has a two second cast, so it has a cast time multiplier of two.

So, let's do some math just so you can see clearly why Flame hits so much harder than fireball. All numbers are made up, but they'll show the relationship:

Fireball: 50 damage, instant cast, does 50 damage.
Flame: 50 damage, 3 second cast, does 150 damage.
Rising Tide: 50 damage, 2 second cast, does 100 damage.

Now, imagine that you could get a spell like Flame to take .5 seconds to cast? Then you'd be able to do a lot more damage, because you'd still be getting the cast time modifier without having to take the time to cast the spell. That's why mages use a lot of cast time reducing buffs in a boss fight. That's where we get all our crazy burst dps. For about 30 seconds, any mage can get .5 to .7 second flames if they use buffs like guitar, Ancient Spirit Water, Arcane Potion and our skill Elemental Catalysis (which gets interesting at level 65).

Mage dps is pretty sad outside of our burst mode, but in burst, when we have all those buffs on, we can cast about 5 or 6 flames in three seconds, so we end up getting a lot of bang for our flame buck.

Cast time multipliers work on all spells that have a cast time- even Wardens have them, even Scouts. That's why Snipe hits so hard.
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
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Eledhwen

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5

Friday, June 1st 2012, 2:45pm

That is indeed some great information. Concise as well. Thanks for helping Borella!

6

Saturday, June 2nd 2012, 8:21am

Might want to add, that casting time multiplier only includes original casting time of spell, so damage won't go lower when you stack casting speed reducing buffs. :p

Sadly enough, spell damage is broken anyways and mostly mdmg and original casting time with some elemental boosting skills matters. Let's say example fireball with 2030k fire damage + 0,3 int hits nearly as hard as lightning with 522 wind damage + 0,1 int... Spell damage is just some mean joke. Skill levels still add some extra damage too and it's recommended to max all skills you use later on. You can see quite a big difference between some 10-20 skill levels already, but one level here or there is not that much.


Hopefully chapter 5 will bring cooldowns back again with some improvements to last fail attempt, and maybe some % from original cast time to minimum cast time instead of flat 0,5 for all spells like all mage damage fail numbers. That might make other skills more useful and playing mage more interesting.

...and of course not forgetting to fix those spell damages and maybe make elemental resistances more useful and... [insert an endless list here]

7

Saturday, June 2nd 2012, 8:55am

if they just would add the % weapon dps to the skill like non-casters....it would rain puppies. scalable skills and non-burn dps fixed. cast speed modifying buffs would increase dmg a bit just as non-casters and all would be well with world.

well i guess you'd have to overhaul the entire...nm

puppies

8

Saturday, June 2nd 2012, 9:04am

Quoted from "pazuzzu;534008"

if they just would add the % weapon dps to the skill like non-casters....it would rain puppies. scalable skills and non-burn dps fixed. cast speed modifying buffs would increase dmg a bit just as non-casters and all would be well with world.

well i guess you'd have to overhaul the entire...nm

puppies


Yeah, I'm not sure how much i trust them to rebalance it...Flame now does 52% offhand weapon dps + 0.7*dex

But if done right, it would be a very welcome change
Quaffy - 87 Mage/ 85 Priest/ 70 Scout (formerly one of the much hated P/S in PvP :()
Heavensfury, Govinda
KilledbyBorella February 15, 2012

gigilomann

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9

Saturday, June 2nd 2012, 9:44am

Quoted from "Quaffy2;534009"

Yeah, I'm not sure how much i trust them to rebalance it...Flame now does 52% offhand weapon dps + 0.7*dex

But if done right, it would be a very welcome change


stay p/s.
For you to live or die is in my hands, In Gigi we trust.

-"Retired as one of the best, Will always be remembered for KT, RT->RT Dia, and GCH"- -Palenque- -XxXGigilomannXxX- -P/K/S-


10

Saturday, June 2nd 2012, 10:25am

Quoted from "gigilomann;534011"

stay p/s.


I'm as much mage as i am p/s, same combo as fan actually. Notice my picture is m/p and sig reading m/p/s

But yeah in arena/siege u'll see me as p/s. Don't think I forgot that one match when u went to the dark side, once you go p/s...umm something to do with staying p/s but also rhyming somehow. Man, I think I need to go to sleep now
Quaffy - 87 Mage/ 85 Priest/ 70 Scout (formerly one of the much hated P/S in PvP :()
Heavensfury, Govinda
KilledbyBorella February 15, 2012

gigilomann

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11

Saturday, June 2nd 2012, 7:38pm

Quoted from "Quaffy2;534019"

I'm as much mage as i am p/s, same combo as fan actually. Notice my picture is m/p and sig reading m/p/s

But yeah in arena/siege u'll see me as p/s. Don't think I forgot that one match when u went to the dark side, once you go p/s...umm something to do with staying p/s but also rhyming somehow. Man, I think I need to go to sleep now


once you go p/s ... there's never a doubt?.. once you go p/s.. you'll do nothing but pout? :p.. Once you go p/s all you'llw ant to do is shout..

yea im bad at this lol
For you to live or die is in my hands, In Gigi we trust.

-"Retired as one of the best, Will always be remembered for KT, RT->RT Dia, and GCH"- -Palenque- -XxXGigilomannXxX- -P/K/S-


L3g3nd

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12

Sunday, June 3rd 2012, 3:07am

Dayum... every second is a multiplier....
I wish my Low Blow had a 10 second cast time and I could start my cast while in Hide. <3 *sigh*

13

Sunday, June 3rd 2012, 3:08am

Quoted from "L3g3nd;534122"

Dayum... every second is a multiplier....
I wish my Low Blow had a 10 second cast time and I could start my cast while in Hide. <3 *sigh*


Cause that's what rogues need is to be more OP. :P
Borella - 100 W/M/S/R/P/K
VVV
If you play P/K in instances you're garbage


14

Sunday, June 3rd 2012, 4:05am

Quoted from "L3g3nd;534122"

Dayum... every second is a multiplier....
I wish my Low Blow had a 10 second cast time and I could start my cast while in Hide. <3 *sigh*


I'd be ok with that, seeing as when you are casting for 10seconds moving would interrupt it and you'd be very unlikely to pull that off in pvp against anything that can move.
Quaffy - 87 Mage/ 85 Priest/ 70 Scout (formerly one of the much hated P/S in PvP :()
Heavensfury, Govinda
KilledbyBorella February 15, 2012

L3g3nd

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15

Sunday, June 3rd 2012, 6:01am

Quoted from "Quaffy2;534145"

I'd be ok with that, seeing as when you are casting for 10seconds moving would interrupt it and you'd be very unlikely to pull that off in pvp against anything that can move.


Oh yes I almost forgot about the 50 distance thing. The distance has to be increased to 200 which is fair because players can travel like what? 400m in 10 seconds?

EDIT: Anyways back on topic. Interesting to note that cast time = direct multiplier. Never knew that. ;)