Runes of Magic US / AU

Quoted from "Garmulan;601024"

Knights shouldn't have to struggle as much as they do to play this game.

From my somewhat limited experience of playing Knight, the problems seems to stem from player mentality.

Everyone stats their gear and tiers their weapon with a view to being top of a dps meter and expects their party to burn down bosses. When this doesn't happen, they blame the Knight (or other Tank) for not keeping Aggro when they should be making sure to not steal lead aggro in the first place. (Done that myself a few times ; made sure not to blame the tank for my stupidity, though.)

Quoted from "Kroagnon;601034"

From my somewhat limited experience of playing Knight, the problems seems to stem from player mentality.

Everyone stats their gear and tiers their weapon with a view to being top of a dps meter and expects their party to burn down bosses. When this doesn't happen, they blame the Knight (or other Tank) for not keeping Aggro when they should be making sure to not steal lead aggro in the first place. (Done that myself a few times ; made sure not to blame the tank for my stupidity, though.)

No, Knights just suck. Warden/Warriors have no trouble holding aggro that a knight would have a lot of trouble with. Even champs generate more aggro. And do about 3x the damage while they're at it.

Knights have needed a fix for a long time, but I doubt they'll ever get it.

Knights are becoming an extinct species just on the fact that Warden/Warriors and Champions Shadow the knight in terms of agro holding. 2 really great knights i know, fully dedicated to being a legit tank of not so much a max dps tank, T7 to T8 Stat'd Armor/T11 Hammer with 1-2 Hatred X's between them popping Agro pots... the whole nine yards/etc. They pretty much left to another server/starting fresh due to the fact that a DPS stat'd Wd/W's, with Shell gear and a T9 Axe/no hatred, could go in and do exactly what the knight was able to do and even more.

(TL;DR: Wd/W can DPS stat to be a better agro holder than a Knight can with 1-2 Hatred X's and agro pots.)

There is definately a want and in my opinion a need for a Hammer Weapon Boost for the Knights

Knights were due for a fix a long time ago. But like Borella stated, it probably won't happen. Knights are still able to do their job properly when played correctly. Which is hold aggro and stay alive. They are just so easily outshined by Wdn/W, Wdn/S, and Ch/R in many categories that there is little incentive left to play K/x over those three combos. That being said, I do believe Knights still need a weapon mastery. Knight general should have K/W's weapon mastery elite skill, 38% when capped at Lvl 50. K/W's new elite could be enhanced weapon mastery bumping it to 50%. It still isn't much, but it's a step in the right direction.

Knights are the new old warden.

Quoted from "ghostwolf82;601061"

Knights are the new old warden.

This.

Been a knight since ch.1 and It's unfortunate that we knights are unable to generate as much aggro as the new tank classes. Low damage on a tank is understandable, but I'm still buggared by the fact that I need a 2 hander for pve so that I don't bore things to death. I myself deal only about 2 to 6k damage in the higher end instances, and just barely stay at the top of the meter as a k/s with 2 hatred X's. If thar be a warden tank in the same party, that fella will have a couple mill more in aggro generated above everyone else most of the time with a singular hatred VIII or some such. Trash mobs are generally a bit tougher to hold aggro on as a knight unless they have a decent amount of patt in exchange for less survivability, as us low patt knights are forced to cast Hatred Strike or an aggro pot for every mob we come across. It's honestly much more fun/easy to play a warden or a champ these days so I've given up on instances and have shifted my focus to siege.

I have been throwing around some ideas on how to fix this.
1. Add melee damage based on the Pdef provided by shield, something like 35% should cover the difference
2. Make aggro increases also increase pdam and patk - My favorite idea
3. Change taunts back to the old formula of Holding aggro for X seconds - Not the best idea...
4. Give Knights Weapon Masteries to match their class combo (K/W should be 1-h Axe and 1-h sword, K/P should be 1-h Sword and 1-h Hammer, K/R should be 1-h Sword and 1-h offhand, K/M should be 1-h Hammer and magic damage, K/S should be 1-h Sword and Ranged weapon)
5. Implement a way for Knights to toggle their Pdef to Patk, Dodge to Pcrit, or Parry to Pdam

Other than that, they could rework some of the skills like Punishment to deal %DPS based damage and have WWS deal more damage when it hits targets that are stunned or rooted.

I think there is room for a tank class that (compared to other tanks) does lower damage, but has better defensive stuff. That tank would need agro increase abilities to make up for the loss of DPS.

Knight currently seems like it tries to be such a tank, but fails. Know of any boss that a champ or warden tank can't tank due to needing more defensive stuff? I don't. And the agro abilities that knights do have I've heard repeatedly can't keep up (when I as a ch/r tank am grouped with a knight, they don't tank and don't think they make effort on agro. so I can't comment from personal experience).

So knight seems like a good idea, just poorly implemented at the moment.

Quoted from "RhazeCain;601202"

I think there is room for a tank class that (compared to other tanks) does lower damage, but has better defensive stuff. That tank would need agro increase abilities to make up for the loss of DPS.

Knight currently seems like it tries to be such a tank, but fails. Know of any boss that a champ or warden tank can't tank due to needing more defensive stuff? I don't. And the agro abilities that knights do have I've heard repeatedly can't keep up (when I as a ch/r tank am grouped with a knight, they don't tank and don't think they make effort on agro. so I can't comment from personal experience).

So knight seems like a good idea, just poorly implemented at the moment.

That's pretty much it. Champions and Wardens do more damage and thus generate more aggro. The only way to keep them in check with Knights without killing off their potential as DPS classes is to give the Knights a lesser but appropriate boost to their damage. Champions have massive Parry without even trying in addition to being able to swap roles on the fly. Knights have no swap ability to give them the ability to fill another role. The one role they do doesn't really cut it because they have low crit rates, and crits produce double aggro (heard this a long time ago from a friend, so don't quote me).
The primary issue with Knights is that they have plenty of CC skills, but CC is pretty much worthless unless you are running pre-endgame content with an undergeared party. They lack in offensive skills to get aggro and keep aggro by doing damage.

Knight:
-Pro:
--High consistent Defense and parry
--High Utility in party
--CC skills

-Con:
--Low damage
--Low burst aggro
--Low sustained aggro
--No alternate roles in party

You can't kill enemies by having massive amounts of defense and CC alone. "You can't heal him to death..."

What is realistically most likely needed is aggro modifiers on weapons for knights. This game is more gear based than skill based. Most tanks in this game use dps mentality instead of aggro mentality, and since knights never got an equal dps boost in comparison to just about every other class, they have a difficult/near impossible time with gaining and maintaining aggro. IIRC, Yawaka Guard is the last weapon that had the beneficial(needed) aggro modifier on it.

So, since GF(or whoever) needs to make their money, the game is gear upgrading intensive. So simply making weapons with the aggro ghost stat would help pull the knights out of the dark ages they have been in, while still making GF their money, in comparison to a skill(s) alteration for knights. I know this is not the most ideal solution for knights, but would greatly help and is rather practical too from GF standpoint.

I see a lot of people crying for a knight weapon mastery, but nobody seems to have recognized the fact that K/W do have a weapon mastery, and it's no longer exclusive to 2h axes. Sure, it only maxes at 38.2%, and could benefit from a boost to at least 50%, but even 38.2% can make all the difference.

Other knight combos could use masteries too, I suppose. I don't think they should be neglected. I'm just pointing out that weapon masteries aren't unheard of among knights. Some knights already enjoy the benefits of weapon mastery.

Kanu does well

/shrug

hatred strike, ww sheild, holy strike till seals, threaten, punishment, ww sheild, repeat problem solved

knight can still hold aggro pretty well theres no doubt about that people are just whining how if one warden or champ is in group, that one swing of their weapon and a knights complete rotation is thrown out the window cuz the champ/ warden just took aggro in that one swing.
and knights are jealous of champs/wardens doing 5-10 mil damage on boss fights.

so wait a min here... weve been crying about knights for years... rofl and this guy makes a post saying i think we should redo knights and weeks later BAM. COuld you make one for scouts now too? lol

Quoted from "FarmerTom;603261"

so wait a min here... weve been crying about knights for years... rofl and this guy makes a post saying i think we should redo knights and weeks later BAM. COuld you make one for scouts now too? lol

haven't u seen noony's threads?

Quoted from "FarmerTom;603261"

so wait a min here... weve been crying about knights for years... rofl and this guy makes a post saying i think we should redo knights and weeks later BAM. COuld you make one for scouts now too? lol

champion needs the bug where I only get healed 50% during Shadow Explosion and that Remodeled body has a cooldown

*crosses fingers*

Not happening