Runes of Magic US / AU

I have a video about scout since you are asking for performances from others



The xbow is level 85, t10 +16.

I only ahve 200m TP. I'm trying to get a lot more TP to have better numbers.

Thanks for coming to share results on the US forums (ure from GR? EU? right?)

I'll be doing my best to optimize my scouts starting with TP *btw i've moved to DIYCE to do all my scout DPS. This is because of pure laziness. I think s/r uses 7-8 skills? I'm not that good of a player to learn how to optimize them manually yet*. I'm happy to see you are taking the time to master the scout as best you can and taking the time to share everything you are doing. Please post all the results you desire <3

Sorry my Scout /Warden is still only about 1/2 of the damage of the Rogue /Scout on the same character. Considering that the Scout /Warden has every skill maxed and the Scout /Rogue has most of its skills at least 20 levels below max it is the 3rd class on the character. The Scout is still a fail for dps. It use to be that the Scout did only about 1/3 of the damage of the Rogue but now it is up to 1/2 so some progress is being made but nowhere near what has to be done to make it viable again. Some of this may be attributed to the Rogue critical which is almost every hit and guaranteed the first hit.

had s/wd run with me. i wouldn't say its great dps, but its at hte point where we can bring one into runs (same with scouts in general now)

It should have the HIGHEST burst. In 3s it should have the highest burst, especially snipe procs. CC is OP AF, and snipe 1s is OP af, but after the 15s of CC, s/r can probably pull ahead.

S/r can pass the CC of s/wd with DPB if they are 4-5 vamp arrows on the targets (there is also a lower CD) but the snipe HP proc (10s) can make s/wd beat s/r. I think the 15s burst tho, with a group of people who can accomplish 5 vamps arrow, s/r > s/wd

keep in mind s/wd get 17% bonus patk.

This is just theory crafting. I only ran with s/wd in GoH and since boss fights lasts 4s... the s/wd owned me.

(also, s/w gets 36% patk or w/e... and I can probably get up to 60k dex. Not that its important. Should probably go 6/0 str/pa for scouts lol )

Quoted from "bleedingblak"

had s/wd run with me. i wouldn't say its great dps, but its at hte point where we can bring one into runs (same with scouts in general now)
It should have the HIGHEST burst. In 3s it should have the highest burst, especially snipe procs. CC is OP AF, and snipe 1s is OP af, but after the 15s of CC, s/r can probably pull ahead.

S/r can pass the CC of s/wd with DPB if they are 4-5 vamp arrows on the targets (there is also a lower CD) but the snipe HP proc (10s) can make s/wd beat s/r. I think the 15s burst tho, with a group of people who can accomplish 5 vamps arrow, s/r > s/wd
keep in mind s/wd get 17% bonus patk.
This is just theory crafting. I only ran with s/wd in GoH and since boss fights lasts 4s... the s/wd owned me.
(also, s/w gets 36% patk or w/e... and I can probably get up to 60k dex. Not that its important. Should probably go 6/0 str/pa for scouts lol )

S/wd get's 17% bonus patk and 5% more damage
S/r and s/wd would be quite par for dps if it weren't for one certain special circumstance with s/wd.
Nimble hands isn't what it used to be for s/r with the change to the damage formula.

In almost every instance, S/wd is going to win over S/r as far as DPS goes.
Both are good for groups, s/r is certainly more helpful for a heavier crit based party (other rogues, scouts, wd/r so on..), and s/wd a not so crit based party.

If anybody is really begging for s/r to be on par with s/wd, I can't say that I'm not okay with it. The 2 best ways I can see this happening is
by nerfing (fixing?) S/wd's CC, and the bonus shot that comes with entling.

OR

By fixing scout's generally crazy low % dps skills and giving other scouts a reason to use shot outside of a proc. (other)Scouts need a filler that does reasonable damage, not laughable.

But undoubtedly, s/w will reign king in the newest instance over these 2. S/W will still stack dex more than (just as much) as any other rogue or scout looking to deal dps. Due to s/w being the class combo that has the highest potential for dex, as battle instinct gives you a bonus 9.5% or whatever + 500 (idk the exact at 90 it's got a weird scale) dex combined with scout general Swiftness gives = %dex + 90 some. Effectively, s/w get's a bonus 54-57% patk with self buffs, and about 17-20% is passive.

TL;DR

Level cap instance -> S/W -> S/Wd -> S/R
Not Level cap instance -> S/Wd -> S/R -> S/W
Far below level cap instances -> S/M -> S/Wd -> S/R

And maybe buff scout general's like Shot, wind arrow, vamp so that they do semi-reasonable as fillers.

I cant help but feel that Mamn00n is giving false information. Can you link some proof with screenshots from goh,pomh,coeh? to support your claims.

Bahlool have you ran with similarly geared s/wd? how does s/r compare to s/wd?

Quoted from "holytrident"

I cant help but feel that Mamn00n is giving false information. Can you link some proof with screenshots from goh,pomh,coeh? to support your claims.

Sure, and your claim is entirely valid. But I don't think screen shots from instances is going to do much. Let alone a specific instance. All you are comparing at that point is your patk, and crit vs boss pdef and crit resistance and then of course how much damage/AS you have, and how much crit damage increase you have.. Which is just a matter of gear and stats. Something that, can be increased and decreased by % bases.

So I can conclude, with X damage and X attack speed with X patk Vs X Pdef I can come out with approximately the amount I'll hit. And scale comparisons accordingly.

As for why I say nimble hands isn't what it was, let me elaborate a little. With the damage formula that Scouts specificly use, makes attack speed have half of a half of the effect other classes get. For example; 10% attack speed for rogues is the equivalent of 20% damage. For scouts, 10% attack speed is 5% damage. Likewise speed shooting mastery has suffered greatly from this.

If what you are saying is that I'm wrong that S/Wd beats S/R in just about every instance then here:

S/Wd gets -> 5% more accuracy (for what it's worth)
-> 17% more Patk
-> Skill that is instant cast that does more % DPS than snipe (but not more damage, roughly 3/4 [75%]the damage of snipe however) which, with the "fix" is now instant, AND does not trigger GCD. So, If I am at a boss fight, I can use Snipe -> CC -> Autoshot -> Shot -> combo and hit target 8 times in 2 seconds. That's insane burst.
-> Skill that allows your Shot to have a second shot going by it's side. The second shot does about 60-70% of the initial shot damage.
-> 5% passive damage
-> 275 reduction in target physical and magical resist (good for not so heavy crit groups)
-> 10%? idk what the level 70 elite buff max's at, but it's comparable to exploiting shot
-> 2 skills that have considerably higher % DPS than most scout skills (Thorn arrow and Hidden Peril, strong fillers)
-> A mid range attack that has a high chance to crit and hit targets in a range of 80 (aoe)

S/Wd's burst consists of using Snipe -> CC -> Shot -> Autoshot -> Comboshot -> (if buffed) shot shot shot shot shot and pop CC, combo, and HP for snipe proc chance when snipe is nearing CD.
If not buffed; Comboshot -> shot -> thorn arrow -> shot -> piercing arrow -> shot -> vamp arrow -> shot -> hidden peril -> shot -> combo and so on... Shot does the most damage for S/wd, and more damage than most scout skills will do (that all have a CD of 6s or more). Giving it consistently higher damage than every other scout combo could manage in all but 1 situation.

S/R gets -> 11.2% attack speed (5.6% damage) passively
-> Offhand weapon (more patk). So, to determine the % of patk that can be gained (roughly) would be as so: 1/16 (1 out of 16 pieces, this weapon making it 17) is about 6.25% more patk gain. That off-hand dagger however, will probably have a nice big patk buff on it. Let's say 3500 patk, which you can get from about 4 stats. And then I'll add in the runes, we'll say you can get 1k patk (I don't feel like mathing this) is about 1.25 more stats. That turns the patk bonus to about 11.7%.
10.5% (roughly) bonus Patk
-> 16% reduction in target pdef/mdef (good for heavier crit groups)
-> 16% increased damage on target
-> 2 extra reflected shots and the damage doesn't decrease (considerably good upgrade to an aoe)
-> Some bonus crit with a skill that does a little more damage than the main scout skills
-> Poisonous bite is a strong filler (but not as much as CC but more than Hidden peril)

S/R's burst consists of, Using snipe -> sapping arrow (0 damage) -> autoshot -> shot (260.8% dps) to proc exploiting -> combo shot -> vampire arrow -> poisonous -> weak spot -> piercing -> and after that you are poppin wind arrow (unless you don't have enough TP to max it, cause wind arrow does more damage than shot) and any of your cd's, combo, vamp, poison, weak spot, and piercing.

TL;DR
If they were to fix the damage formula for scouts so that 1% attack speed =\= 2% damage like EVERY OTHER CLASS DOES then S/R would be just about on par with S/Wd. The difference right now, as to why S/Wd is better than S/R could be most simply said as so:

S/Wd has more physical attack, more buff potential (situationally) and almost every skill used having = to or more % dps
S/R has .6% more passive damage, and they have equal buff potential, but Sapping Arrow (S/R) doesn't stack with withering seed (Druid general). So, without a druid S/R is a good way to get more debuffs on the bosses. But with a druid, S/R is not as practical.

I'm pretty confident in my claims. But feel free to disagree

based on what i saw in runs and what has been posted on the forum, it feels like scout is balanced now it feels like a m/w where you do all your damage as a burst at the start. It might be slightly lower dps then rogue/mage but then it brings more to the pty with some damage increase for the party members.

feel like some ppl are asking for some more cake while they still have their mouths full.

Scouts balanced? A well needed buff? Yes. Anywhere near balanced? No. Still more work to be done

And here I thought Jon Snow being real was a rumor.

Full of peasants is what this is. Where's the bacon?

People are living in a fantasy world. The Scout is still totally unbalanced and underpowered. It does no where the damage of the mage, rogue wardens etc. . What the Scouts got was a small buff. It was a upgrade to be sure but nowhere does the Scout appear to be even close to other primary classes. What basically happened was the Scouts went from about 1/3 the dps of the other dps classes to 1/2. In other words when a Mage or Rogue etc does 1,000,000 damage the Scout went from doing 333,000 to 500,000 This appears great but in reality is just a start. It looks better and for the starved Scouts an improvement which makes many people they were balanced but they still are doing nowhere enough damage. The detection, range, buffs and survivability of the Scout still is terrible. This is a very small step 1 but only that. The first burst is still better bit still not anywhere near that of other classes and ends far sooner and the Scout still dies before the burst is complete.

S/Warden is the best but does not do the damage of Warden/ Scout when you count the pet and has nowhere near the survivability. The same is true of S/R and R/S. Comparing one Scout primary to another is not a good way to look at the upgrade . You should compare the different primary classes.