Siege: Mercing and Sandbagging

Beginner

Monday, September 17th 2012, 5:28am

We fought a guild tonight (and I can't count how many before tonight recently), but they were FULL of mercs. We were all the way up to 1800ish points and nothing changed on our side (player wise) but we unfortunately are now down to 1K because EVERY guild in between have had CRAZY mercs and/or sandbagged down to this level just for the points? Mats? Whatever their reason may be...... BUT IT IS SO STUPID. It makes the rest of the guilds who just honestly try and want to fight fair fights in siege NOT want to play ROM anymore because its always just a brutal beating. WHY can we not make people who leave one guild and go to another wait...ooooo I dont know... a week? before they are able to actually participate in siege. Or if you MUST siege because you have to have those winning points....go fight with guilds thats under 500 and are probably just "place holder guilds" or what have you. Why must WAY OP people come down to low level guilds and fight low level people... I just don't see the logic behind it. Does it make you feel good that you beat on smaller people who aren't as OP?... I don't know what else it could be. Anyway, i'm sure i'm not the only one who feels this way...and i'm sure people who merc all the time is going to read this and call me a baby and tell me to just increase my stats or something....but its hard to increase your whole guilds stats and it would take alot of time and money (which i've already put tons of both into this game) to be as OP as some people. WE JUST WANT CLEAN FUN SIEGES. Not brutal beat downs by mercs........

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SWayne2

Beginner

Posts: 22

2

Monday, September 17th 2012, 6:29am

To be honest, there are a few people that do lower their siege points or go to lower lvl guilds to fight lower lvl guilds, but you can't honestly believe that every guild you go up against that rolls over you are in fact what you call mercs. There are guilds that may not have their normal people on a night and lose and then go up against a guild and walk over them, there can be guilds that have good numbers that just go up against another guild and get rolled over themselves and then they get dropped in points and just so happen to be stronger than the guild your in. Doesn't mean they are in fact what you call mercs. So just because you get rolled over don't automatically call merc or what not because it may just be one of the above reasons that caused their numbers to be lower.

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TheTymos

Beginner

Posts: 21

3

Monday, September 17th 2012, 5:28pm

I completely agree with that, sometimes stronger guilds will have a couple bad days and be down in points just like us but when you know for a fact that their mercs that makes it different. i looked back in my war records last night and compared to posts on the forums recently which some say who they are and what server/guild their in along with other people that play on my server that say that had just fought the same people a couple nights before in another guild, 1 or 2 thousand points higher. To me this means their either mercing or their doing what i had another guild admit to me one night in siege way, they play in 1 guild and get it up to 2000 range and they have a alt guild that they let lose on purpose, one their main guild is in the 2000 range they leave it and go to the alt guild, they get the alt guild up to the 2000 range and in the mean time let their main guild lose on purpose, one their alt guild is up to 2000 range they go back to their main guild and do it all over again. and someone actually told me that in the middle of siege war about 2 weeks ago while they were kicking the crap out of us.

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Uccello

Trainee

Posts: 98

4

Tuesday, November 20th 2012, 7:28am

I understand a guild having a bad run and loosing points. Thats the way it goes. However there are guilds on Govinda that I have watched their point drops. Then when they get in our point range and we go up against them Either no one or very few show up. I am talking high end guild with a min of 5k before they start dropping. And its the same guilds. Another thing they do is create an alt guild and then move their people over to it. That gives them an auto low point guild but with high end players. At least 1 guild I know of has done that.

We have also ran into the merc issue. It is getting bad. We have fought guilds with people we know are in a top guild, and yet here are 4 or 5 of them in one guild and amazing enough the guild they actually belong to is in as well, and loses.

The only solution I can come up with, if frogster was so inclined. Is a 24 or even 48 hour ban on joining a guild once you leave a guild. Another would be a minimum number of players that have to enter siege or the guild is banned from playing for a length of time. Both of these in combination would slow down the merc problem

"Gameforge is working on it"

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camagic

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5

Tuesday, November 20th 2012, 1:14pm

I can verify from personal experience that when leaving a guild after sieging the previous day, there is a 24 wait. The 1 hour wait is only when not participating in the previous siege.

In addition is the normal no joining block two hours before, during, and two hours after siege completely ends.

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ruisen2000

not a wallet warrior

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6

Tuesday, November 20th 2012, 5:09pm

The problem is, it only takes 58k HP to buff up to 100k HP with lv 50 pet- which still makes you look quite intimidating in siege, and people still call "mercs!" if they see you with half a dozen 100k+ players in the lower point level, even though they wouldn't do so if they see half a dozen 58k HP players.

If you've taken too many points and are coming down, you'll get it the hardest, because people will assume they're meeting a tough fight, and max buff. Or, you get massive guilds that win by sheer numbers, even though 90% are 30k HP lowbies, and sometimes, its really difficult to say who's mercing and who's not.

And of course, as mentioned above, you get hard guilds, and your points drop. I've seen getting 4 hard guilds with more than double our points in 1 week. Dropped from 2500 points to 1900. Steamrolled a couple unfortunate 1800-1900 point guilds before we moved up again.

Not that there aren't professional mercs, I've seen 0 people show up on 3k point guilds, but I'd think that would be much rarer then whats mentioned above. Don't think you could meet these type of guilds every day for a week.

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RoMage

rustyx is lame rogue

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7

Tuesday, November 20th 2012, 7:33pm

LOL

We had a steak of bad luck and mismatch, like 4-5 SW in a row, one of them against 3-4K higher guild - we fought all of them to last min if possible, but our points dropped badly.

Then we ended up with another guild around our new points grade - and were called hax and many other unpleasant names. At the end of SW they decided to give up, even they were not far away from us with gear or numbers.

After couple more SW, we had them again and they decided to stay on roof of castle?!

We even tried to see how long we can last against real guild, but giving up like that... come on...

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Bakken

Professional

Posts: 710

Location: Canada

8

Tuesday, November 20th 2012, 7:39pm

ugh point droppers are just a bunch of cowards

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sertet

Professional

Posts: 796

9

Tuesday, November 20th 2012, 8:07pm

Quoted from "RoMage;577787"

LOL

We had a steak of bad luck and mismatch, like 4-5 SW in a row, one of them against 3-4K higher guild - we fought all of them to last min if possible, but our points dropped badly.

Then we ended up with another guild around our new points grade - and were called hax and many other unpleasant names. At the end of SW they decided to give up, even they were not far away from us with gear or numbers.

After couple more SW, we had them again and they decided to stay on roof of castle?!

We even tried to see how long we can last against real guild, but giving up like that... come on...

A steak of bad luck sounds tasty, but probably not too good for you.

Anyway apparently for some mercing is all fine and dandy but using treaches merits insults, name calling and threats, but then again some of those people were always known for the drama

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Auros

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Tuesday, November 20th 2012, 9:18pm

Please define Mercing. I always thought mercing was something a high level OP toon would do, advertise himself for sale to highest bidder to come in to a lower level guild and win their seige for them. TBH, I have not seen this behavior in ages. In all the guilds I have been in, it has always been considered a stupid thing to do to hire Mercs. So what if they win you a seige, now you are stuck at a higher point level and now you have to keep paying to stay at that level???

Now, I have seen OP toons drop down to lower level guilds to join them when "their guild did not get a spot". But again, I think this is a stupid thing for that guild to accept them for the same reason.

Mercing, I do not think is very common.

However, that being said, what I do see a lot of is higher point guilds register and not show up to intentionally drop points, and all of them join an "Alt" guild of theirs at a lower level to roll the lower point guilds. IMHO this is dispicable behavior.

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RoMage

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11

Tuesday, November 20th 2012, 10:08pm

Depending on guild, especially if many older players, you never know how many will show for sw.

We usually have 10-15 players, but other night only 5 of us showed for SW. We managed to hold for 35 min against 17 players in other guild. (k, 4.5 in our case if you count lame mage such as myself for 1/2 :p)

Sometimes you can't predict what will happen, and in some cases (like rage quit) some guilds will be on loosing stake for a long time to adjust their level.

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Ziav

Professional

Posts: 755

12

Wednesday, November 21st 2012, 1:40am

Quoted from "Auros;577795"

Please define Mercing. I always thought mercing was something a high level OP toon would do, advertise himself for sale to highest bidder to come in to a lower level guild and win their seige for them. TBH, I have not seen this behavior in ages. In all the guilds I have been in, it has always been considered a stupid thing to do to hire Mercs. So what if they win you a seige, now you are stuck at a higher point level and now you have to keep paying to stay at that level???

Now, I have seen OP toons drop down to lower level guilds to join them when "their guild did not get a spot". But again, I think this is a stupid thing for that guild to accept them for the same reason.

Mercing, I do not think is very common.

However, that being said, what I do see a lot of is higher point guilds register and not show up to intentionally drop points, and all of them join an "Alt" guild of theirs at a lower level to roll the lower point guilds. IMHO this is dispicable behavior.

Merc'ing is exactly as you defined it, adding people who didn't get in with their guild so they join yours, siege then leave guild. THAT is a merc. So you don't pay them, you are benefiting by having them in siege with you. If your guild doesn't allow mercs then don't invite players you know belong to a different guild.

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Ziav

Professional

Posts: 755

13

Wednesday, November 21st 2012, 1:42am

Quoted from "camagic;577752"

I can verify from personal experience that when leaving a guild after sieging the previous day, there is a 24 wait. The 1 hour wait is only when not participating in the previous siege.

In addition is the normal no joining block two hours before, during, and two hours after siege completely ends.

I know for fact this is not true. I've seen guildies leave guild during the afternoon, join a different guild for siege then rejoin their original guild later that same night.

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ruisen2000

not a wallet warrior

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14

Wednesday, November 21st 2012, 3:09am

Quoted from "Auros;577795"

Please define Mercing. I always thought mercing was something a high level OP toon would do, advertise himself for sale to highest bidder to come in to a lower level guild and win their seige for them. TBH, I have not seen this behavior in ages. In all the guilds I have been in, it has always been considered a stupid thing to do to hire Mercs. So what if they win you a seige, now you are stuck at a higher point level and now you have to keep paying to stay at that level???

Now, I have seen OP toons drop down to lower level guilds to join them when "their guild did not get a spot". But again, I think this is a stupid thing for that guild to accept them for the same reason.

Mercing, I do not think is very common.

However, that being said, what I do see a lot of is higher point guilds register and not show up to intentionally drop points, and all of them join an "Alt" guild of theirs at a lower level to roll the lower point guilds. IMHO this is dispicable behavior.

I've never heard of people charging fees to come and merc lol. Most of the mercing that I've seen was 1-2 friends in different guilds coming to siege with each other. Or their guild didn't get siege spot, and they'll find someone else to siege with for that night.

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camagic

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15

Wednesday, November 21st 2012, 4:25pm

When I was in the fifth grade, the teacher paired us up. We turned the two desk to face each other and got into arm wrestling position. The teacher then told us every time we get the other student's hand to touch the desk, we get an extra 100 factored into our grades. We had 30 seconds and were set off. All the other students imediately struggled, grunting and groaning, against each other. I was luck to be paired up with one of the smartest kids in school, and he pulled my hand down to make his touch the desk. I caught on and we switched back and forth, gaining 18 100s each, while nobody else got anything.

For me, the funniest part was watching everyone else struggle needlessly against each other.

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shopguy

Intermediate

Posts: 345

16

Wednesday, November 21st 2012, 5:04pm

There are plenty of legit reasons for everything stated here, and until some of the fundamentals of PvP change in this game, it doesn't really matter. If you are lucky you get 1 even fight out of 10, and it would be that way with or without these "sandbaggers and mercs". The main reason I see people *merc is because there guild doesn't have siege that night, so they go to any guild that will take them, or where they have some friends, because they enjoy siege. What is the alternative that is better? I can't think of one, not without changes to the game code/design which isn't put in yet so no reason to QQ over it (if you like add a suggestion, that's best you can do).

*merc = not the right word, but I don't have a better, so OK

My guild is currently what you call "sandbaggers" I think, went from our main home with 20k guild points to an alt guild with 300 or so points. We have a lot of people on vacation and what not, and others just taking a break from siege, and are also trying to spend more time in KBN to gear up.... I guess you would prefer we just don't siege at all, none of us, or that we continue to siege in our main guild. If we siege in our main guild it will be a roflstomp by the other side because we don't have numbers currently. If we siege in our alt guild, it's a roflstomp by us... basic human nature, which do you think we'll pick given the options that the game allows? Now, if the game had more/better options, that might be nice.

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Ravesden

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17

Wednesday, November 21st 2012, 7:11pm

Quoted from "shopguy;577893"

There are plenty of legit reasons for everything stated here, and until some of the fundamentals of PvP change in this game, it doesn't really matter. If you are lucky you get 1 even fight out of 10, and it would be that way with or without these "sandbaggers and mercs". The main reason I see people *merc is because there guild doesn't have siege that night, so they go to any guild that will take them, or where they have some friends, because they enjoy siege. What is the alternative that is better? I can't think of one, not without changes to the game code/design which isn't put in yet so no reason to QQ over it (if you like add a suggestion, that's best you can do).

*merc = not the right word, but I don't have a better, so OK

My guild is currently what you call "sandbaggers" I think, went from our main home with 20k guild points to an alt guild with 300 or so points. We have a lot of people on vacation and what not, and others just taking a break from siege, and are also trying to spend more time in KBN to gear up.... I guess you would prefer we just don't siege at all, none of us, or that we continue to siege in our main guild. If we siege in our main guild it will be a roflstomp by the other side because we don't have numbers currently. If we siege in our alt guild, it's a roflstomp by us... basic human nature, which do you think we'll pick given the options that the game allows? Now, if the game had more/better options, that might be nice.

Just ask nicely, we might go easy

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regentego

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18

Wednesday, November 21st 2012, 7:53pm

Our guild is funny, on the weekends we are 25-30 deep, and on the weekdays its 10-15, this is just due to peoples schedules, last night we faced a guild I felt really bad for cause it was one of those random nights more people showed up for on a Tuesday, they still outnumbered us but gear wise they were not able to handle 3 of us. It would have been a 20 minute siege if they didn't start defending their castle in the first 5 minutes.

Anyhow Im sure they thought we were point dropping. Feel terrible everytime we draw a much lower geared guild, I would rather lose and fight hard then just make another guild look foolish. Anyhow that's my story!

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trav42073

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19

Thursday, November 22nd 2012, 4:18pm

ive had an idea for a while but imagine not many would care to do it but i would rather focus on pvp with the other guild than mess with taking towers and all that. you get same rewards for tie as u do win so just leave towers and lets fight in the middle where the landscape is perfect for active pvp fights. just my opinion. i spend more time running back to castle to get defenses and crap and very little time actually doing any pvp wich was and is the whole reason I siege period.

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