Runes of Magic US / AU

chain killing is not as prevalent as people make it out to be...to chain
kill a group, by going into hide after every kill, you NEED to 1 shot
every player in that group, or else u are stuck out of hide for too long
and will probably die...couple problems with this: 1) once the guy at
the back dies, the rest of the group shud be throwing around all ur
aoe's, pop rogue out, easy kill. 2) if a rogue can 1 shot your entire
group, do you really think you had a chance against him, even w/o hide?



Answer to 1 The Rogue has throw and combo throw and if a r/s using a bow with shot or vampire arrow can far out range all aoes of any class or the joke of the scout's detection spell and just stay out of range . Blindly throwing out a aoe spell like thunderstorm has little or no chance of finding a rogue who knows how to play One shot kills are not necessary a fast combo will get you in and out long before you can be targeted.
2 Any character can be brought down by a group no matter if they can 1 hit everyone in the group the use of stuns freezes lasso etc can stop or slow long enough for the whole group or enough players to hit the rogue with enough damage to kill it.
Very poor arguments.
.

the only ranged skill I see being an issue with 1 shots is combo throw...the other do not do significant enough damage to a well geared player to kill them instantly...I have to stress that combat will end a second or 2 after the enemy is dead if u ever enter it. a 1 shot kill rarely enters combat in the first place, meaning hide can be used as soon as GCD is up, or if u 1 shot with throw, instantly...

also, aoe's can pop rogues out pretty easily, as long as u have an idea of where they are..."blindly" throwing up aoes will have less of a chance to get the rogue, but they can still be caught by surprise...

@group v. 1: sure, there can be coordination, and success, but most of the CC skills are broken by damage, as well as have diminishing returns, and the ones not broken by damage are easily cleansed...if the group just flat out burns the solo player down, they will probably lose a good many people, even more if the solo player has aoes...

I hate these threads so much. That is all

Quoted from "Mrpushpop"

I hate these threads so much. That is all

How come? Its fun to debate and keeps the forum alive and running although R/M is kinda OP.

Honestly, I think the P/S nerf was more of a gesture than proof of long term communication. By the time that thread got to 60+ pages and a second one got to 40+ pages, that was around the time GF KA came in with a lot of promises of communication, and it made sense as a gesture to implement the single complaint that had become one of the largest threads.

Look at the communication now. When's the last time they communicated with us? We asked for all those IS changes and got 5 rune drillers instead. Who knows what "nerf rogues" would get translated to by the time it reaches GF . Maybe it even becomes translated into "Nerf mage weapons" and that's why staves keep getting nerfed lol.

I don't think the majority of the people are really looking for the kind of nerf that's terrifying all the rogues, for the simple fact that:

a) Many of your guildies are now rogues or have rerolled as a rogue
b) Many of your ingame friends are probably rogue or have rerolled rogue
c) Both.

Even if they did get a small nerf, it wouldn't really hurt R/M given how OP they are anyway.

Quoted from "Darwec"

Quoted from "Cike"

totally agree darwec, but it is also like comparing pve to PvP gear...

pve =/= PvP, but people seem to think that just because they are OP for pve, they will dominate PvP, which isn't the case...

rogues just happen to be viable in both, but even then, many of the big PvP rogues have specially designed PvP gear...

if you run around in pvp with glass cannon pve gear, ur gonna get 1 shot...and while u are making new gear for PvP anyways, make it for ur warden, champ, or knight offclass, and bring that into PvP...

The thing is, rogues hope to kill you before they take damage and then rehide. Easy solution to that is: dont die to damage. Make pvp gear. But thats expensive. I have half a set of pvp gear for my r/wd, its only marginally effective and i HAVE to have a healer on me at all times. I could finish my pvp gear and be a beast of a r/wd, but meh. Its expensive. There are some other games that handle this issue well, but it hurts the games pockets:

Force us to make a second set of gear for pvp.
We use our honor points to make it (the way we do now) at a much lower cost than it is at now (Because no one wants to waste their honor points on siege gear). You also get to buy stats (already on mana stones) for your gear from these vendors. Regular gear still allowed (for those who prefer the glass cannon builds) but pvp gear making should be either cheap or totally free.

No no no. >.< Making a set of PVP gear totally free just for PVP? Ugh no. It's bad enough this game is swinging towards guilds' desire to completely dominate in siege war instead of more PVE/PVM with EVERYONE worrying about how a build or a developer decision will affect SW instead of the ultra hard instances they keep pushing out because EVERYONE in the game gears for SW and expects that of everyone else or "you suck", or "gtfo". Turning this game into a PVP-fest is bad enough how they've done it, it doesn't need to be that way even more so.

t's bad enough the Honor Gear resists damage from a player...with everyone running around with that gear on in SW, with stats you can buy everyone will stack the same amount of everything (Stam/HP/PAtk or MAtk), fights will last super long with EVERYONE able to stack the same stats. Each class and each build has it's advantages and weaknesses in this game (except Scouts because they got nerfed into hell), with the infinite ability to customize both your toon's looks and stats to your playing style, either PVP, PVE or both. Don't ruin that.

I'd rather see r/m changed individually than a blanket adjustment if r/m is in fact the problem...it would be like lowering all priests water based damage by 40% because IB was "OP"...

and is it just me, or is x/m an OP combo for almost every class?

Quoted from "Cike"

I'd rather see r/m changed individually than a blanket adjustment if r/m is in fact the problem...it would be like lowering all priests water based damage by 40% because IB was "OP"...

and is it just me, or is x/m an OP combo for almost every class?

Almost. Wd/M still sucks.

@Jguy Long fights actually look kinda fun though. If you get the chance, check out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbvMSE6uKQM from 5 and a half minute onwards. Especially after 25 minutes in the video, now those fights start to get pretty long.
(I know, I'm like obsessed with Kuro's siege vids... lol)

Quoted from "ruisen2000"

Quoted from "Cike"

I'd rather see r/m changed individually than a blanket adjustment if r/m is in fact the problem...it would be like lowering all priests water based damage by 40% because IB was "OP"...

and is it just me, or is x/m an OP combo for almost every class?

Almost. Wd/M still sucks.

@Jguy Long fights actually look kinda fun though. If you get the chance, check out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbvMSE6uKQM from 5 and a half minute onwards. Especially after 25 minutes in the video, now those fights start to get pretty long.
(I know, I'm like obsessed with Kuro's siege vids... lol)

It's not that I don't like long fights, but everyone running around wearing pretty much the same gear in the same stats (just difference between magical and physical attack) does not look appealing to me and honestly not that fun. I've been in several fights with toons equally geared than I that took more than a minute or maybe even two (zid comes to mind where he's left me with less than 10,000 HP) and then the next fight I leave him with less than 10,000HP), but this happening with EVERY fight? No thanks.

@jguy thats why i added in parts about allowing pve stats as well, so that if you want to have high attack (or if they want to introduce stats that increase player damage *cough*) that would be effective. Or improved bleed damage stats. A m/p in sw is never going to have high enough defense to matter. Stating normaly for a m/p would still be optimal. But for the many many people out there who play r/wd m/wd s/wd r/k s/k w/k w/wd etc...the free pvp gear and pvp stats would balance out the game so much. It negates all the problems everyone has with rogues, that everyone had with p/s, that everyone had with scout...it makes the game more challenging, it closes the gap between the insane high point pvp guilds, and the rest (Because that IS the difference between those guilds and everyone else...they spent money on pvp gear).

gonna make honor gear on r/s soon if nothing changes lol

just +12 bag statted stuff is crazy op

I think nerfs to any class are uncalled for...how about we channel rage and frustration in another direction like buffs for the other class combo's that are lacking to be somewhat equivalent to the current "op" classes? Just a thought

Quoted from "Jguy"

Quoted from "ruisen2000"

Quoted from "Cike"

I'd rather see r/m changed individually than a blanket adjustment if r/m is in fact the problem...it would be like lowering all priests water based damage by 40% because IB was "OP"...

and is it just me, or is x/m an OP combo for almost every class?

Almost. Wd/M still sucks.

@Jguy Long fights actually look kinda fun though. If you get the chance, check out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbvMSE6uKQM from 5 and a half minute onwards. Especially after 25 minutes in the video, now those fights start to get pretty long.
(I know, I'm like obsessed with Kuro's siege vids... lol)

It's not that I don't like long fights, but everyone running around wearing pretty much the same gear in the same stats (just difference between magical and physical attack) does not look appealing to me and honestly not that fun. I've been in several fights with toons equally geared than I that took more than a minute or maybe even two (zid comes to mind where he's left me with less than 10,000 HP) and then the next fight I leave him with less than 10,000HP), but this happening with EVERY fight? No thanks.

Why? One hit kills are boring. It might be fun for a bit, but really it's just stupid. SW isn't even about skill anymore. P/K's stand there urgent urgent urgent urgent their 400K hp tanky yet still hitting hard as crap Warden/champ/rogue/knight. Then there's mages standing back one shotting everyone with EGWB or flame spam or earth pulse. In the mean time tanky K/M and W/M run up and oneshot even well geared people.

It's so silly. PvP SHOULD be interesting. It's not really. It's all about either who is more tanky or who can burst 500K damage in 3 seconds. What they should have done was implement the 75% or whatever damage reduction and reduce heals as well. That would go a long way towards fixing PvP and making it interesting.

On PvP gear, I don't think that PvP gear was a good idea. I get what they were trying to do, but with the amount of money it costs to make PvE gear alone, statting a halfway decent PvP set is simply too expensive for one hour a day.

Anyway i'm rambling it's late, but the only real problem with Rogue's is that they burst so hard so fast from hide. If damage was reduced and their burst wasn't able to kill 99% of players, they wouldn't be so much of a problem. They ARE a burst class after all. The real problem is that PvP doesn't last past burst, so burst classes like M/wdn and Rogue shine.

@Borella yes! yes! nerf the healers! nerfff themmmmmm! >

No really, healing has been an issue in pvp for a while. Here is the issue: either you swing to far to the tanky side in this game or the bursty side. So either you get one shot, or you dont deal damage. And the people who are middle of the road do no damage and get one shot and then complain on the forums.

Quoted from "Darwec"

@Borella yes! yes! nerf the healers! nerfff themmmmmm! >

No really, healing has been an issue in pvp for a while. Here is the issue: either you swing to far to the tanky side in this game or the bursty side. So either you get one shot, or you dont deal damage. And the people who are middle of the road do no damage and get one shot and then complain on the forums.

Quoted from "Darwec"

@Borella yes! yes! nerf the healers! nerfff themmmmmm! >

No really, healing has been an issue in pvp for a while. Here is the issue: either you swing to far to the tanky side in this game or the bursty side. So either you get one shot, or you dont deal damage. And the people who are middle of the road do no damage and get one shot and then complain on the forums.

Healings not a problem so long as damage is still this high. But yes, if they were to nerf the damage the healers need to be brought down as well.

As long as we have classes that can white hit for 500K, or classes that can burst 3x 200K wound attacks from hide, PvP is never going to be fair. Easiest way to solve that is damage reduction. See: Other games.

@borella well...wd/s with d/wd or p/k healers are pretty annoying. Ive taken on some lower lvl guilds in my half pvp gear and a healer. Like 8 people rushed me and I destroyed them. There are some issues with that, but in that case I think it was my healer and I out geared them. But i can see a world were everyone is running cheap PVP gear with uber healers and ... its more fun than what we have now but its also frustrating.

Right but you've still got classes like K/M or W/M that could go oneshot that Warden or P/K or D/wd. Though I admit P/K is.. pretty ridiculous with the change to Shield of Discipline. If I have SoD up you're gonna be hard pressed to kill me no matter what class you are.

Honestly, a P/K that can't die spamming 120K urgent heals IS pretty crazy, but so is a K/M with 500K pdef hitting for 500K white hits with SoD. Or a R/M hitting for a couple 150K combothrows from hide. Most of those problems would be much better with the damage reduction, though they'd have to make sure that they kept the correct ratio of heals to damage reduction otherwise they would risk making healers completely useless.

The only reason I don't agree with PvP gear in this game is that it's too expensive. 99% of people can't even afford to make decent PvE gear, let alone a complete new set of PvP gear that has to be enchanted and statted and runed. The cost of this game is astronomical.

yep 75% damage reduction should have been implemented a long time ago ;-(

@Borella give us free pvp gear! (free gifts might make people more...enthusiastic about this game again)

Quoted from "Darwec"

@Borella give us free pvp gear! (free gifts might make people more...enthusiastic about this game again)

Even if you had full PvP gear and Upgraded Def 7, K/M will still hit you for nearly 200k, and a C/M can still crit you for nearly a million damage with ER. WA will still dish out 195k if all 3 crits (assuming 200k crit each w/o PvP). I had a warden hit me for 300k CC. With all that, it would be down to 100k. Something tells me I won't live very long either way...

Quoted from "ruisen2000"

Quoted from "Darwec"

@Borella give us free pvp gear! (free gifts might make people more...enthusiastic about this game again)

Even if you had full PvP gear and Upgraded Def 7, K/M will still hit you for nearly 200k, and a C/M can still crit you for nearly a million damage with ER. WA will still dish out 195k if all 3 crits (assuming 200k crit each w/o PvP). I had a warden hit me for 300k CC. With all that, it would be down to 100k. Something tells me I won't live very long either way...

giveen proper pvp gear, no rogue would crit that hard on wound, unless you mean that all 3 hits cobmined MIGHT add up to that much. Even in poopy sw gear, nothing has hit me for upwards of 80k crits on physical damage.

Magical damage is...differnt.