[Feedback/Discussion] SiegeWar Changes

Intermediate

Thursday, November 6th 2014, 5:40pm

Quoted from "lemony2"

This thread surprises me how many are in for support of the new siege/guard changes and Im surprised at RoM putting this upgrade of the guards in before a toon level increase, its slowly breaking my guild... one of my guildmates said, it Might have been ok if toons level had been raised before or at the same time

it used to be some what fair, if you were outgear'd or out numbered you still had a chance, heck even myself as a healpriest could take a tower, I cannot take a tower now, if the enemy sets up to guard lure I cannot hit a guard with a catupult to protect my gates it will kill me and I cannot tank it for my guild either and I cannot heal the gates of the damage

this is bad, very bad with so many things broke in siege, the enemy hitting us thro the gates, guards being lured... why would RoM think this is good? It Fixes Nothing, adds Nothing To Fairness....

This is my thought as well.
More difficult is good, but making it hard just dumps on lower levels and smaller/weaker guilds. the strong guilds will keep getting stronger, weaker guilds will be stuck where they are.
I expect a faster growth of alt guilds.

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sperle

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Thursday, November 6th 2014, 6:33pm

Quoted from "heirienza"

Actually, it feels like it's more evened out now. And about the guards being lured to gates... I think that should be fixed. At the very least make using it bannable or if it already is bannable, then ban everyone that does it intentionally.

Currently not a banable offense.

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ruisen2000

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Thursday, November 6th 2014, 6:42pm

Quoted from "lemony2"

This thread surprises me how many are in for support of the new siege/guard changes and Im surprised at RoM putting this upgrade of the guards in before a toon level increase, its slowly breaking my guild... one of my guildmates said, it Might have been ok if toons level had been raised before or at the same time

it used to be some what fair, if you were outgear'd or out numbered you still had a chance, heck even myself as a healpriest could take a tower, I cannot take a tower now, if the enemy sets up to guard lure I cannot hit a guard with a catupult to protect my gates it will kill me and I cannot tank it for my guild either and I cannot heal the gates of the damage

this is bad, very bad with so many things broke in siege, the enemy hitting us thro the gates, guards being lured... why would RoM think this is good? It Fixes Nothing, adds Nothing To Fairness....

Strong guards work both ways though. If a weaker guild is defending a guard, that makes it much more difficult for a stronger guild to cap a tower, (unless you're talking about a PPK vs 1000 point guild difference, then nothing will help the 1000 point guild). Your guild can even just focus on hiding in invisis and killing the person who's kiting the guard, so main guard goes back to fighting/shadowprisoning opponent group while you guys take potshots at them.

And if you're at a lower end range like my guild, I put a ton of treches in invisis all around the guard, and there was once where the guard wiped the entire opponent guild and their siege engines without me doing anything except killing their kiter

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lemony2

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Thursday, November 6th 2014, 7:23pm

yes rui, thats what was happening we had one of our strong people on the enemy kiter and then we were throwing all the rest of us at the person trying to take the tower... we had no merits to put up more defs, they took the tower and we couldnt take the tower back and then they brought siege engines to the gate, and you cant heal the damage that THING does

it wasnt a fun siege

does Anyone know if its Even POSSIBLE for a heavy heal/druid to put up enough heal to save a gate from thos things?

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heirienza

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Thursday, November 6th 2014, 9:26pm

A few p/wl chars can if they have their 70 elite.... But yea, the healing effectiveness needs to be boosted. There's been discussion about this on the EN side about the SW changes here.

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Borella

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Thursday, November 6th 2014, 11:08pm

A healer shouldn't be able to heal a gate through siege engines. That's kind of the point. Siege is about using siege engines to take down a gate. You're supposed to kill the siege engine. Siege isn't about sitting behind a gate spamming heals.

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Rougetopriest

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Thursday, November 6th 2014, 11:40pm

Quoted from "Borella"

A healer shouldn't be able to heal a gate through siege engines. That's kind of the point. Siege is about using siege engines to take down a gate. You're supposed to kill the siege engine. Siege isn't about sitting behind a gate spamming heals.

Exactly :3 And as many have said before, healing is still pretty OP in this game :p

If you can't keep a gate up through siege engines, either get more healers or kill of some siege engines... 2-3 healers on a gate healing requires way to many siege war engines to damage past already... >.>

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bleedingblak

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Friday, November 7th 2014, 12:34am

You can cleanse mark of destruction (a debuff from siege engines that makes gates take 10-100% more damage) from the gate making siege engines less scary when on gates.

Like Borella said, point isn't to heal gates. Personally, I wouldn't even let anything be put on gates (heals, buffs etc).

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Concerned2

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Friday, November 7th 2014, 6:04pm

I'm feeling like a noob... Had a p/k capping towers without fearless thru upgraded electrics, flames and even a guard once. Being a p/k I hadn't figured the combo of immune spells/pots. Any ideas on how, so this p/k knows....

Erebos - Serius - P/K/M

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BlankMinded

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Friday, November 7th 2014, 6:31pm

If there was a champion/mage with the priest it is possible that it was casting High-energy Barrier, a 20% hp shield, on the priest. This would prevent towers from interrupting the priest from capping. There's other possible ways to cap a tower while electrics/flames are still present, but that's the easiest one to explain. As for guards, you can pull them away from towers and cap while they are busy fighting other players.

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Concerned2

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Friday, November 7th 2014, 6:42pm

He wa alone or running with a Mage combo, forgot which combo. But mostly alone to cap, was strange... Like I said made me feel like a noob.... LOL

Erebos - Serius - P/K/M

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heirienza

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Friday, November 7th 2014, 7:03pm

Shield of discipline and holy candle shield stack, causing you to take 1 - 2 damage a hit. This causes a lot of hits to be resisted (though SoD can't be used at the same time as Wave Armor). As for immunes.... I don't think p/k has enough immunes to cap without fearless. To get rid of the towers hitting me, I tend to use Wave Armor, though the guards will destroy it. This all being said, I'm ot too sure how he could've immune capped it without the use of fearless or a warlock's bubble, or a ch/m. Are you sure he didn't have fearless on for the first part of the capping?

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Zerienga - 90/90 P/K
Téster - 95/61/60/45/45 CH/WL/R/P/M
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If you want to contact me quickly and efficiently, try the US IRC channel.
No, I don't know everything. I just use my knowledge to form educated guesses
And I listen when others say I am wrong in order to learn.

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "heirienza" (Nov 7th 2014, 7:27pm)

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vfwiffo

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Friday, November 7th 2014, 8:09pm

The way I look at it is that stronger guards require teamwork. Instead of a solo capping in a few seconds, you have to get a team over, destroy defenses (and defenders), then have someone kite the guards or kill them while others cap. While I have seen questionable solo caps, overall there is more of an element of group strategy to it. Which is good thing, all said and done.

That said, yeah, the lower geared guilds are gonna struggle. It would be nicer if there was a scale factor, giving lower ranked guilds weaker targets. Kinda like instances, where you chose the difficulty you want to tackle based on your power level.

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Concerned2

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Friday, November 7th 2014, 8:41pm

rustyX I was talking Bout a solo cap he was doing. Siege was fun except the solo cap guy.... And a few that try to pull guards into gates... But now that siege seems to be getting closer match (or was last couple nights) the dynamics work better. But see a priest solo cap with flames and electrics without fearless was interesting.

Erebos - Serius - P/K/M

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Gutterboy

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Friday, November 7th 2014, 8:44pm

Fearless capping still works right? Why don't people just use it more during the fight instead of using it as a least minute tactic?

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ruisen2000

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Friday, November 7th 2014, 8:56pm

Imo, current guards would be fine if there were siege engines that can stand up to guards, and a push could consist of better geared playes on foot, less geared in vehicles. Then siege would really be players and vehicles fighting together, and not just both sides babysitting their towers

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BlankMinded

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Friday, November 7th 2014, 11:28pm

As far as I know, the damage of ANY vehicle inflicted on players is very minimal. So they're not actually helpful in a group fight unless they can hold aggro on guards or something -- in either case they aren't helpful at defeating enemy players. They work wonders on gates now though. Also, with enough players in a single ferless lion ram, you get access to a 30s cd skill that heals the ram for like 2.5m hp which might help against the guards a little bit.

At the very least, vehicles provide a much safer method for transporting players across the siege map. A lvl 30 won't get ganked by a rogue as long as he stays inside the vehicle.

And yse, fearless capping stil works. I've used it already to cap towers mid-combat. I'm sure some well timed caps in mid-fight can help turn the tides of combat.

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sleze

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Sunday, November 9th 2014, 12:56am

Quoted from "lemony2"

does Anyone know if its Even POSSIBLE for a heavy heal/druid to put up enough heal to save a gate from thos things?

We have been able to heal a gate with no problem with three d/wds on it keeping it above 80%. The only problems we ever face is when Warden/scouts exploit and send their chirons through the walls.

I don't support 1 Server. I just like the Anagram - GOAT GRIP!

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Rougetopriest

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Tuesday, November 11th 2014, 10:40pm

Speaking of that, everyone should now keep in mind with the increased aggro range of the crystal towers in siege war, warden pets can now easily be drawn to attack it before their masters notice. We can only hope wardens are fast to react to their dumb pet's mistakes however, they are sometimes... quite hard to control (pokemon gym badges comes to mind... lol). This ofc is an old aspect that should be of main focus to get fixed, along with any other skills that hit directly through walls or obstacles.

As for healing, like Sleze said, if your guild has a couple healers working the targeted gate they should always be able to keep it up unless a strategy was used by the opposing guild to get a fast tornado + multiple scrolls off against you. If they do this with ease, or are easily able to stack rams up against you, then this is a unfairly matched siege war and sorry there is nothing you can do. But unfairly matched sieges there has always been, the new siege engines and guards did not change that aspect either.

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