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1

Friday, April 13th 2012, 9:17pm

GCH 5th BoSS

Sooo basically my guilds stuck on Grafu Castle's 5th boss (Hardmode). We know the strat, Meat Wine Candle, and acid.

What basically I'm wondering are the little things.
My guild always has a wave that screws us over ~3rd
We don't kill all the mobs, or the meats not in the middle, or something, and people start to die. (Yes I know you can rez between rounds if all mobs are dead)
Finally - We have random people grab soup to make room for more meat and stuff (Sometimes they agro a mob or 2)..is this recommended, since stragelers are uber deadly?

Basically I'm wondering how you (other guilds past this point) do meat/wine/bread. Since we only get to the boss ~ 1 of every 6 tries, and never with more then like 5 people (12 manning).

Our settup for Meat Wine Bread (To be called MWB from now on (Cause I'm lazy :)) is having 1 person designated for each. So Person A is meat, B wine, C candle.
the other people in group all have designated jobs. As in if A dies A2 (Meat 2) takes over.
If B dies same thing (But with a B2, different person then A2)
We have 3 people designated per job (A1 A2 A3)
We typically have 2~3 healers (depends who's on) that try to res between rounds.

Basically...How do you do it?
Do we just need more experience at it?
I've seen groups that
Have 1 person do all 3 (Usually W/R with movement skills)
Always have meat down (Sometimes the mobs ignore the meat, why and when is this?)
Groups that have 2 people doing every job at once, ect.

We typically have 2ish people that can survive 1 mob hit, (Tank and a healer)

Also Can druids convert the mobs?

Basically - Tell me the little tips and tricks, what works, what doesn't, and I'll be much obliged :)
(If There is a thread like this already please post a link, I searched for keywork Grapu and Caslte ect.)

2

Saturday, April 14th 2012, 12:27am

have everyone in the party do NOTHING...stand around and watch, clear soup when it pops. have the 2 kiters do wine and candle, one always wine other always candle, since they are on the floor, can see it and wont make the mistake of grabbing it before proximity aggro is attained. do not heal the kiters and the kiters dont damage the mobs...just prox aggro. it's not normal aggro...once proximity is grabbed it wont drop unless the kiter dies or the meat is placed.

have the meat person drop it only after the kiters have aggro. once all the mobs are on it, only then do you hit the wine then candle. otherwise you will have a mob random aggroing or going after a kiter which makes it likely the kiter cant get back in position for the next wave. ignore the soup...it's not really useful in hard mode. it makes the mobs slower but its real use is it makes them take more like normal damage in case theres a straggler up when boss spawns. but if theres a mob up in hard it's usually an entire wave of mobs. swap and reset

have a timer call out clear floor 5 seconds before next wave. last wave place the meat near the entrance so you have maximum time to buff without running away from mobs in case they didnt die fast enough. start full buffing rotation at 3min 45sec..let tank gain aggro and also make sure hes closest to barkudnub. serenstrum the debuff called on a specific person. never do skills that can interupt. jump and strafe to opposite side ~.75 sec AFTER the throw poison is cast all at once. if 1 person runs too early it spreads the poison everywhere...rinse repeat.

now with the levels we gained you can easily burn him before throw poison. if youre comfortable even before he does the poison call on a single person with a 6 man group.

**** kiters MUST have show damage on so they can see when the other kiter has put their item on***

items reset if aggro resets from a kiter dying sometimes...anyone can kite, they run slower than dirt but not the tank is usually a safer option.

dont res out if you wipe until the mobs despawn..it used to bug the door. not sure if it still does

mnkmurphy885

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3

Saturday, April 14th 2012, 1:07am

Wow, a few months ago I swear I made this same exact post. I know how you feel, cause we died on that boss for oh, I dunno, felt like a month.

Here's how we do it:

We have two kiters. You didn't say how many you have kiting zombies, some people use 1, we get better results with 2. They stand across the room from each other and when the wave spawns they swap positions, running a big half-circle past the entrance door. I am sure you have seen this in videos, cause that's where we got it from. The Kabal video shows kiting the best iirc.

Ok, now the tricksy part.

Don't assign random people to do meat wine and candle. Assign two people to do meat, one on each side of the room. Have every other person stand either on top of the tables or behind them or behind a pillar. No one goes out on the carpet except the meat people and the kiters.

So who does candle and wine? The two kiters do it. They need to be in voice chat. As they are running to the other side of the room they see which they have available on a table and they call it out so the other one gets the opposite. If one has only wine, the other guy gets candle, etc. Wine person says "wine out" as soon as it finishes casting, and that's when the other kiter casts the candle. He calls it too, just so we all know we're good.

So, let's say I am kiting. I don't need to be any special class combo, I just need Escape Artist and Unbridled on. I stand on the edge of the carpet a few feet down from the boss, and as soon as the wave spawns, I start running toward the door, past the door, and back up the other side of the room. When I run past the tables I have already seen what wine or candles I have, and I call out to the other kiter what I have, quickly. Let's say I have 2 candles. I holler "candle!" as soon as I see one. The other kiter will then look for wine. If he sees one he'll holler "wine!" If he only has candles he'll say so, and then I will look for wine, and we'll tell each other what we have. The better you get at this, the less often you will die. So, as soon as we are clear on what we're going to grab, wine person wines (meat is already down at this point) and says "wine out" and then I cast my candle.

Then the zombies die and we get into position for the next wave. Ideally, you want someone on each side of the room using soup on them too, if they have it, because it slows them down, and that helps, especially on the last wave. They don't need to get too far out on the carpet to cast it either, and as soon as it's done they go right back to on top of the table or behind one.

The meat people also need to be in vent, and we call out ahead of the wave spawning which one of us has meat for that wave. That way only one person puts down 1 meat. So, I usually do meat, and Yuki does it on the other side- he tells me as soon as he gets back from putting a meat down if he has one for the next wave. If he doesn't, I get ready, I find my meat, but I don't pick it up til the wave spawns and has run past me. That's because when the combat status changes (ie when you drop in or out of combat) items you have clicked on despawn. We had issues with disappearing meats before we discovered this.

We drop our meat ideally right where the two people cross each other's paths in the middle of the carpet by the door. If you lag or are late, drop it as close to the middle as possible.

That's the strat we use, and lemme highlight the important bits.

1) the people doing the strat need to be in voicechat. We have people who listen but can't talk, and they make macros, so one kiter has a macro for "GOT WINE" and "GOT CANDLE" and "GOT BOTH" and "GOT NOTHING" and "WINE OUT" and "CANDLE OUT". One meat person has macros that say "GOT MEAT" and "NO MEAT" etc. One of the two MUST be able to talk and respond quickly to the one using the macros tho. We have done this successfully with one person using macros and the other talking, and also with both people talking. We've never done it successfully with two people using macros. It's too slow.

2) everyone else needs to STFU. Only people doing the strat talk at all, and one person calling out waves. We have a non-strat person count waves, and they call each wave number as soon as they spawn, with a special "LAST WAVE BUFF NOW!" on the last wave, and that is all they say. Soup people do soup silently.

3) your kiters are partners, and they have to cooperate and call out their candle or wine quickly. Your meat people are partners, and they need to be on that meat fast, and they must communicate, because having no meat or two meats down means a wipe. Soup people are independent, and they just do their thing as they see an opportunity. Everyone else, even the wave caller, just chills out and stays the hell behind the tables and off the damned carpet. No one makes a peep except the two kiters, the meat people and the wave caller.

Ok, if you do all of those things, you will not have stragglers at all. Stragglers are caused by extra people on the carpet or too close to the carpet. Zombies don't have battle aggro, they only have proximity aggro. So, as soon as they spawn, they should get solid aggro on the kiters, cause the kiters are the ONLY PEOPLE STANDING ON THE CARPET. They start running, and then the meat person can safely deliver his meat. He can run right through the mobs, because the kiters have aggro.

As soon as the zombies transfer aggro to the meat, the kiter can pick up their items and safely cast them. Then they get back into position.

You have to do all this quickly though, because the kiter that casts the candle will have aggro as soon as they eat all the meat, and they'll start running to him as they die. This is why soup is nice- if they get souped they will be slowed, and less "oopsie"s happen, where the mob of zombies catches up to the kiter and ganks him. Usually you can kite em up the side of the room, but sometimes you get too far up and get ganked by the next wave spawning on top of you. Just reset if that happens.

There are some issues you will run into no matter how perfectly you do this:

1) Getting item-screwed. Sometimes there is no candle. Or wine. There is almost always enough meat unless your meat people frack up and put two down. When that happens, swap gear and reset.

2) Kiter gets ganked. This happens too, if they don't get souped and they get unlucky or lag. Swap and reset. Don't try to have a backup kiter, it is too hard.

3) Meat person get ganked. Usually, the kiters will have solid aggro and the meat people can walk right through a zombie and have no problems. Sometimes they get whacked for no apparent reason. Just swap and reset.

You need zero healers for the zombie banquet. You will need all of them for Herl as soon as he spawns though. Herl is a whole 'nother ball game. You will ideally have a druid cleansing off the poison debuff that he does when he calls someone's name.

Ok, this post is epically long already, but lemme splain the last wave and Herl fight quickly, cause you will need it soon.

As soon as the eighth wave spawns, the wave caller says "LAST WAVE BUFF NOW" and people do the following: they call their pets, they get their food and hero pots on (no point wasting them if you have to reset), they get their normal self-buffs on. They should already all have priest and party buffs on from the beginning.

As soon as meat is down they come out from behind the tables and line up; we use a vertical line going up and down the room on the right side, with the tank in front closest to the boss. Others use a line across the room. Someone grabs a soup we save just for the last wave and soups the mobs as soon as they get the last wine and candle so no one gets ganked.

If anyone in your party has the quest "Startlight" there will be some npc chatter, and the boss fight gets delayed. People play music, and as soon as the boss hits the tank they pop their short term buffs and burn. If someone has the quest, you get a bit more time in burn before he casts "Throw Poison." As soon as he finishes casting that, the whole party runs to the left side and lines up again. This takes practice, and chances are good you will wipe the first few times. People can use serenstrum to survive the poison the first wave.

After you master all that the boss is easy, tank and spank and run like hell :)

Look, if you actually make it to the end of this monster post, I thank you lol. I know exactly what you're going through, and you have my sympathies. As you practice, you can have everyone do it in their swap gear, so no one gets dura loss. Eventually you will get so good at it that you'll wonder why it was so hard.

Good luck, *hugs* and many thanks to Kabal, to Pazuzzu in Core and to all the others who helped us get through the Zombie Banquet when we were chain wiping :)

And please feel free to PM here if you have questions, or whisper me on Fandreith if you're on Palenque.

Or... Paz could say all that in three paragraphs before I got done typing my book up. Sonofa... anyway, I hope it helps lol.
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
World First solo Amboriar
Paz on mages: i have full and complete faith blizzard will keep us fail and balanced.

4

Saturday, April 14th 2012, 1:09am

oO omg..you have done it. you have beaten your record for longest novel

err forum post*

lmao

5

Saturday, April 14th 2012, 1:13am

For the record we dont even do it that way no more -.^ she hasnt been around much....

Lately it's be me kiting with a mage helping me get items and our rogue doing meat while in hide... Everyone else stays behind a table on my side so i get aggro. =]

6

Saturday, April 14th 2012, 1:16am

Quoted from "tavar321;524778"

also can druids convert the mobs?



omg do you know how easy this would make life be?!!!!

7

Saturday, April 14th 2012, 2:47am

<- is also a d/s which is why I asked about converting mobs. (Also means cleansing)
Soo I can cleanse the debuff he yells out that means?

Heard that W/R with run speed pots + escape title makes a extra good kitter, we have 1 that may or may not be willing
Heard the same about mages since they can thunderstorm slowing mobs down, but you say its all proximetry agro, soo thunderstorming won't draw agro?
Is it smart to use someone as a kitter if they can take a hit if its main tank and the mobs still hit for like ~150k?


Q) What kinda candy? I assume rainbow crystal but never checked.
Q) Do you recommend getting soup? Thats when we seem to have people get the extra mobs
Q) Should healers stay in main gear so when peeps switch they have time to heal more?

And for the realllly long poster
Yes I read the whole post
I used to post like that (Diff forum)
I know it takes forever to write (Its harder on you in my opinion lol)

Btw forgot to mention - We have EVERYONE in RC, (Not all can actually talk)
We do do the counter seperatly
I think we timed the time from words till boss fight ~18 seconds (Not positive on this)

Hi Pazz! (EoT guild) (I think I'm the only D/S besides amanda and she's really /m (I am rerolling for a /W though) (Mystery who I am o.O)

Hopefully going to be asking for a similar guide for anneliah in a little :D (I hear 6 is just a burn)

mnkmurphy885

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8

Saturday, April 14th 2012, 3:24am

You really don't need people that can take a hit, or ones that can run especially fast.

You shouldn't be getting hit at all, and Escape Artist + Unbridled is enough to outrun them easily.

No t-storming, no charming, don't have anyone attempt to damage them at all. Just kite.

And don't try Whooty's strategy yet, that's the advanced beast mode method. Just make sure all your peeps are off the damned carpet, meat gets down, and they get wine and candle on em ASAP, and you'll be fine :)

And shoosh, I know I write novels. I am the Prolix Mage. Fear mah paragraphs!
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
World First solo Amboriar
Paz on mages: i have full and complete faith blizzard will keep us fail and balanced.

9

Monday, April 16th 2012, 9:49pm

Quoted from "WhootyHoo;524825"

For the record we dont even do it that way no more -.^ she hasnt been around much....

Lately it's be me kiting with a mage helping me get items and our rogue doing meat while in hide... Everyone else stays behind a table on my side so i get aggro. =]


I didn't get it. Can you be more specific how this "beast" method works? :)

mnkmurphy885

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10

Tuesday, April 17th 2012, 6:33am

What Whooty means is that she solo-kites, and someone helps her get wine or candle (she does the opposite) while a rogue drops meat (he can cross the floor in hide). So there are 3 people doing the strat instead of 5. Everyone else is hiding behind the tables doing absolutely nothing.

This is great- as long as the people doing the strat are pro as hell and know their rolls. Hence my calling it "beast mode."

This method is gonna be more dangerous and possibly downright impossible unless you have great communication and people who know the strat backwards and forwards. Not for beginners. Well, if you have a rogue and two other people who are super-pro and communicate great- it could work. It's just that the 5-person method is tried and true and allows a lot more leeway for boo-boo's.
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
World First solo Amboriar
Paz on mages: i have full and complete faith blizzard will keep us fail and balanced.

Amberwave

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11

Tuesday, April 17th 2012, 4:35pm

We came up with our own method to deal with the mobs, and we now can spawn the boss on most of our attempts. We have yet to try the boss fight as a full party. For the boss fight, I'm assuming we have 30 sec to deal with the last wave of mobs before the mechanics of the boss fight starts. Using a timer, I'm showing that the boss spawns ~4m17s from the spawning of the first set of mobs. Interrupts during the poison cast seem to cause the spell to cast immediately. I have three questions, 1) What is that orange glow that looks like a warden buff during the mob phase? 2) What do the NPC's do that show up,? if anything. and 3) What do you do if you have a couple of mobs left when the boss spawns? Sometimes a couple of them just do not cooperate.

12

Tuesday, April 17th 2012, 10:52pm

Hi aries o.O
<-Elf
Another problem...
Last wave. We seem to run outta stuff.
Soups are also taking up spaces, but soupers can grab agro killing alot of peeps, so we don't use em.
We're thinking of just dropping all Food left during round 8, this might create agro issues, but hopefully theres enough meat down to prevent this...

mnkmurphy885

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13

Wednesday, April 18th 2012, 1:39am

Quoted from "Amberwave;525544"

We came up with our own method to deal with the mobs, and we now can spawn the boss on most of our attempts. We have yet to try the boss fight as a full party. For the boss fight, I'm assuming we have 30 sec to deal with the last wave of mobs before the mechanics of the boss fight starts. Using a timer, I'm showing that the boss spawns ~4m17s from the spawning of the first set of mobs. Interrupts during the poison cast seem to cause the spell to cast immediately. I have three questions, 1) What is that orange glow that looks like a warden buff during the mob phase? 2) What do the NPC's do that show up,? if anything. and 3) What do you do if you have a couple of mobs left when the boss spawns? Sometimes a couple of them just do not cooperate.


The orange glow they get shows that they've either aggroed onto the meat or been souped/wined/candled (can't remember when they get it, just remember that it's when they start interacting with food). It's just a visual cue.

The NPC's just talk amongst themselves and delay the battle a bit. They also delay the first Throw Poison.

Getting item-screwed sucks. Sometimes it's unavoidable, but it's most easily managed by having people using the soups (or at least grabbing them off the table and letting the expire) and by clearing waves quickly, so you have items used quickly and hence respawning faster.

That last wave needs to be managed perfectly. You can boo-boo on any other wave and recover, but if you are slow, have stragglers or lose people on the last wave you may as well swap and reset.

The trick is getting them meated as soon as possible, wined and candled the second they all get on the meat, souped (save a soup for last wave) so they're slowed (this prevents ganking) and make sure that meat is by the door, far away from where the party is gonna be grouping up and buffing.

So, here's the scenario: Wave spawns > Kiters take off > meat person drops meat instantly by the door > mobs aggro onto meat > wine thrown > candle thrown > soup thrown > mobs die close to meat while simultaneously your group gets in their line, buffs, tank gets in position. Then you gather up the people doing strat, play instruments, and do the boss fight. Boss dies, loot leet stuffs :)
Formerly Fandreith, currently Fanndreith, 90 Hunter
World First solo Amboriar
Paz on mages: i have full and complete faith blizzard will keep us fail and balanced.

brogue

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14

Wednesday, April 18th 2012, 4:24pm

Don't pick up the soup till the meat has been placed and you should not have any aggro issues. You absolutely need to clear soups or you will perpetually have issues on this fight.

When we did GCH on a more regular basis we would designate one person for meat, one for wine and one for fire, with a back up for each. This fight is all being quick and knowing when to enter the floor area and having some good kiters. You do not enter the floor area till you see the mobs aggro on your kiters. We always use two kiters. Once they aggro, the dance starts. Each individual person placing meat, wine, candle should either be by their designated responsibility or know where it is. If done quickly each person should have plenty of time to tract down their meat,wine,candle, NO EXCUSES. People sitting in the stands need to clearing the soup, ONCE the mobs are on the meat.

Dropping all meat during the last phase will make the mobs go all crazy, doesn't work. ONE meat per round!! The NPC's who show up are part of the Starlight quest and make the boss spawn slower once all the rounds are finished.